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Post by diemex on Sept 21, 2007 5:56:54 GMT
Chose PIXIE subrace for this.
Start with unmodified stats : STR 9 DEX 17 CON 16 WIS 8 INT 14 CHA 8
Level 1-40 Rogue. Stat gains = DEX
Pre-Epic Feats in order taken : Strong Soul, toughness, point blank shot, rapid reload, wpnfoc (LT xbow), imp evasion, improved critical, def roll, iron will, opportunist, gr fort, slippery mind.
Epic Feats in order taken : Epic WpnFoc, GR DEX 1, crippling strike, GR DEX 2, Skill Mastery, Epic Dodge, ESF Open lock, GR DEX 3, Self Conceal 1 & 2, Epic Will, ESF Diasable Trap
Legendary Feats : Hardened Soul, LWF, Self Conceal 3-5, LSF open lock and disarm trap.
@40 naked (36 AB / 29 AC) 360 HP 516 skillpoints. Do what you want with these... theres more than enough to take max in most skills you need + extras.
Real crappy AB on this guy from what I can see... unless theres some decent +10 or higher light xbows out there. But if he can hit... 20d6 sneaks should hurt good.
Mostly a leech I think... but his main purpose is to provide support to a team by being able to open/pick anything in his way. I didnt bother with enhancing search.. I think its redundant since find traps whould reveal them.
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Post by the1kobra on Sept 21, 2007 10:54:33 GMT
I really think you should get more rogue levels. You really want to capitalize on that sneak attack to get your damage to decent levels. The way I see it, the best options for a crossbow rogue (having played a few) are at the moment a 37/2/1 Rog/Pal/Monk, which gives 19D6 sneaks, or when acaos is done haxxoring the system, a pure rogue with crippler which ignores sneak against everything. Also, if you play a crossbow rogue and want to get the upgrades to crippler strike, use a light crossbow, they get the benefits, a heavy does not. But as your build is now, I don't think it will deal enough damage. Keep in mind that the fourth attack for an xbow rogue is meaningless, so you don't have to take 4 of a BAB 1 class pre epic. I think if you're not going to go pure, you should try something like 37/2/1 Rog/Pal/Monk or 32/3/5 rog/monk/HS.
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Post by diemex on Sept 21, 2007 12:03:05 GMT
Thanks for the input !
The 4 BAB1 pre-epic was for flexibility... i.e. ability to drop down to monk gloves or a finessable melee weapon should the user become disenchanted with Xbows.
I'm a little late on the ball regarding the 'possible' changes to rogues... I just read some this morning and that ability to sneak attack sneak immune mobs will certainly have me rethinking my rogue levels.
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Post by the1kobra on Sept 21, 2007 14:24:12 GMT
Here are the rogue changes. * Rogue - +1 skill point / 10 rogue class levels in LLs *Rogue
Upgrade traps from trap makers.
- Crippling Strike - With 30 levels of rogue, the rogue receives +1 to his critical range when using a light weapon and in light or no armor. This does not stack with Overwhelming Critical or Ki Critical; With 35 levels of rogue, the rogue has a (rogue level + 10)% chance of receiving a +1 bonus to his critical multiplier with light weapons when in light or no armor. This does not stack with Devastating Critical or Increased Critical Multiplier; With 40 levels of rogue, the rogue ignores sneak attack immunity against almost all opponents. - Opportunist - The rogue carefully calculates all attacks in advance. With 25 levels of rogue, the rogue gets to add his BASE Intelligence modifier to all attack rolls with light weapons, to a maximum of ((rogue level - 20) / 5) (capping at +4 with 18 base Intelligence at 40 levels of rogue); In addition, provides +1 AB at 30 levels of rogue, as long as the rogue has at least 12 base Intelligence. - Skill Mastery - With 21 levels of rogue, all skill penalties in the Hells are lowered to 2/3. With 31 levels of rogue, all skill penalties in the Hells are lowered to 1/3. With 40 levels of rogue, the rogue is completely immune to any effect which would decrease his skills, inside the Hells or elsewhere. - Slippery Mind - With 30 levels of rogue, provides a reroll on ALL Will saves and not only mind spells. Just remember with crippling strike, the light crossbow will recieve the benefits but the heavy crossbow will not. If you're sticking with monk, you will want to also put 2 pts of str into con. It will leave you with 6 str, but its not a big deal on a ranged rogue. If you dont take monk, you will want to take wis away as well and put it elsewhere. But yes, you should capitalize on your sneaks aggressively, there is a big difference between 11D6 sneaks and 19D6 sneaks, trust me.
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Post by starlandra on Sept 22, 2007 14:28:37 GMT
ditch self conceal. Many mobs (and it seems a majority of em) in LL areas and the hells have listen or blind fighting. That effectively dumps SC V usefulness in half. Not worth the 5 feats in my book
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Post by FunkySwerve on Sept 22, 2007 20:38:10 GMT
Not halves, multiplies by itself (yes, I know you said 'effectively'). That wouldn't be important if it were being left at 50%, becuase .50x.50 IS half of 50%. If raised to 62% or more based on hide, as we are currently considering, however, the effect of blind fight would be more attenuated: .62 x.62 = .38, whereas .62 halved is only .31 - 7% different. The higher above 50% conceal you go, the more important this difference becomes. Funly
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Post by diemex on Sept 23, 2007 16:47:56 GMT
Modified original post. Now as a pure rogue.
Additional comments ?
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Post by flynn01 on Sept 24, 2007 18:29:34 GMT
Does opportunist work with your light x-bow? Or, for that matter, Crippling strike?
if so, you might want to try to fit 2 more int in (drop st to 8 and dex to 16 as a possible way for this.)
Do you know if Craft Weapon affects ranged weapons? Maxing it could help.
There is a lvl 55 light x-bow, very good attack bonus.
Do you think you will need ESF open Lock?
You'd be... unwise to ignore search. Though true that Wizards with the Find Trap spell and maxed Search are better at it, there are times when you need search to even find the *Chest* or the *path* to the chest.
Only take the LSkillFocus if you don't think, through gear or party buffs, you reach the +50 skill cap. If you ever get the gear you need, you may regret taking those feats. Of note, the Epic Skill Foci are seperate from the +50 cap.
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Post by starlandra on Sept 24, 2007 19:54:37 GMT
bah still say you want 4 fighter for the 4 attacks a round
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Post by diemex on Sept 24, 2007 23:06:52 GMT
bah still say you want 4 fighter for the 4 attacks a round Only works for melee... does not affect Xbow. Xbow will have 4 attacks regardless... 1 standard, +1 (or 2) HG mod, +1 Haste, +1 rapid reload. (so its 4 or 5...not sure completely about the bonus HG assigns to xbows) Does opportunist work with your light x-bow? Or, for that matter, Crippling strike? Pretty sure it does. I think at 40 ranks you only get +1 AB.... dont think its worth the tradeoff.. those 40 could be better spent elsewhere. Well I dont know... I'm not rich so top end items are not in my stash. I have no idea what the LL locks are like. I've seen DC 130's and I have to wonder how I can reach that even maxed out. I wasnt sure about search... if its important... I can move stuff around and take it.
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Post by edonil on Oct 14, 2007 10:35:12 GMT
you could use a stinger for this build your lose 2 ac do to size but gain the ability to use a shield when the going gets ruff "Stinger" (secret Ultra Rare subrace) - requires Human (changes Appearance) STR +4, DEX +2, CON +2, WIS -2, CHA -2, free feat: Spring Attack, increased base movement rate - fast, able to walk on quicksand, increases character size to large, speaks Stinger
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Post by flynn01 on Nov 26, 2007 21:57:46 GMT
is point blank shot useful for crossbows?
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Post by the1kobra on Nov 27, 2007 0:04:30 GMT
It definitely is. It removes the AB penalty for shooting in melee, and it gives you an AB and damage within close range, AKA sneak attack distance, which you should always be in. I suppose you could skip it if you have a beholder's crossbow, which has it attached, but I don't like to have to be dependant on gear for feats.
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Post by chirikov on Nov 27, 2007 3:33:40 GMT
sneak distance is actually twice pbs distance iirc. the damage bonus is kinda negligible at higher levels, but 4 ab is something you dont really want to go without on a tier 2 build
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