Undying Bard Looter (59 Bard / 1 Rogue)

[louisvilleslugger]

Pro's:
Double duty: Handles Necessary Bard Duties and Rogue search/open duties.
Bard epics (W/ 60 CHA modifier to them for max range): Illusion, Necro, Transmutation, Enchantment

Con's:
No spell Penetration--don't cast on SR creatures unless the druid turns them green.


Let me know what you think. He's basically a party support 99% of the time.

============================================================
59 Bard
1 Rogue
Race: Elf
- +2 DEX, -2 CON

Subrace: "Undying" (secret Beyond UltraRare)
- Never Gets XP Penalty
- STR +2, DEX +2, CON +4, INT +2, WIS +2, CHA +2, free feat: Dodge, free feat: Luck of Heroes, free feat: Great Fortitude, free feat: Iron
Will, free feat: Lightning Reflexes
- Undying receive +3 skill points per legendary level.

Starting Stats:
Str 8(10) --0
Con 12(10/14) --4
Dex 14(16/18) --6
Wis 8(10) --0
Int 16(18) --10
Cha 16(18) --10

1. Feat: Artist (free: dodge, LoH, GF, IW, LR)
2.
3. Feat: Curse Song
4. (CHA EVERY TIME)
5.
6. Feat: SF-Illusion
7.
8.
9. Feat: GSF-Illusion
10.
11.
12. Feat: SF-Transmutation
13.
14.
15. Feat: GSF-Transmutation
16.
17.
18. Feat: SF-Enchant
19.
20.

Pre-Epic BAB=
Pre-Epic HP=
Pre-Epic Save= (fort=6 , reflex=12 , will=12 ) -BASE
Pre-Epic Skill points =


EPIC

21. feat: GSF-Enchant
22.
23. b.feat: Lasting Inspiration
24. feat: Great CHA 1
25.
26. b.feat: Great CHA 2
27. feat: Great CHA 3
28.
29. b.feat: Great CHA 4
30. feat: Great cHA 5
31.
32. b.feat: Great CHA 6
33. feat: Great CHA 7
34.
35. b.feat: Great CHA 8
36. feat: Great CHA 9
37.
38. b.feat: Great CHA 10
39. feat: Metamagic-Extended Spell
40. Rogue 1 (Max out Open Lock, Disable trap, Search, Set trap=5)

Epic BAB=
Epic HP=
Epic Save= (fort=16 , reflex=22 , will=22 )
Epic Skill points =


LEGENDARY

41. Book: ESF-Necromancy
42. feat: ESF-Illusion
43.
44.
45. feat: ESF-Enchantment
46.
47.
48. feat: ESF-Transmutation
49.
50.
51. feat: Epic Skill Focus-Open Lock
52.
53.
54. feat: Epic Skill Focus-Disable Trap
55.
56.
57. feat: Epic Skill Focus- Search
58.
59.
60. feat: Legendary Luck

Leg. BAB =
Leg. Base save = fort=21, reflex=27, will=27)
Leg. Base HP =
Leg. Skill points=

====================================
Skills (total skill pts= 4 + 4 (INT) + 59 (Bard Bonus) + (undying 3*LL=60)= 623 points

Open Lock=63, Cost:103
Disable Trap=63, Cost:103
Search=63, Cost:103
Set Trap=5
Discipline=53
Tumble=60
Concentration=50
Parry=63
UMD=20
Perform=63
=====================================
Final CHA

60 = 16 (base) + 2 (subby) + 10 (lvlup) + 10 (LL) + 10 (G.CHA) + 12 (items)

Final Max. Saves

(CON14(26)=8, DEX18(30)=10, WIS10(22)=6, +20 to save throw from items, LoH=+1, IW/LR/GF=+2, Leg.Luck=+3)

Fort=21+8+20+1+2+3=55
Reflex=27+10+20+1+2+3=63
Will=27+6+20+1+2+3=59
======================================

[mishimayukio]

Bards and barbs get an extra 60 skill points in LLs, its not documented anywhere but an obscure update note a few months ago.

[louisvilleslugger]

May 18, 2009 16:48:11 GMT @mishimayukio said:

Bards and barbs get an extra 60 skill points in LLs, its not documented anywhere but an obscure update note a few months ago.

I did not know that! I'd probably cap out concentration and UMD then. Or maybe take taunt or pick pocket.

[Acaos]

More specifically, bards and barbarians receive an additional 1 skill point/level (with pre-41 points granted retroactively at 41), even if their control class is not bard or barbarian.

The documentation will be fixed in the next documentation update.

Acaos

[MightyKhan]

i take it this means 1 additional point per level of barbarian and bard? (instead of splashing barbarian or bard netting an additional skill)

[Acaos]

May 19, 2009 13:19:43 GMT MightyKhan said:

i take it this means 1 additional point per level of barbarian and bard? (instead of splashing barbarian or bard netting an additional skill)

Correct. If you take 15 bard levels but have, say, fighter as your control class, you will get 15 extra skill points.

Acaos

[louisvilleslugger]

Update:

Used the Saves artifact (Tymora's Charm). Increased the saves and the +20 to skills makes gear swapping less needed (at least for 10 rounds that is).

Build has become extremely valuable due to the increase in hell secrets value.

[crimsonbinome22]

May 18, 2009 12:00:04 GMT louisvilleslugger said:

Skills (total skill pts= 4 + 4 (INT) + 59 (Bard Bonus) + (undying 3*LL=60)= 623 points

Open Lock=63, Cost:103
Disable Trap=63, Cost:103
Search=63, Cost:103
Set Trap=5
Discipline=63
Tumble=60
Concentration=63
Parry=63
UMD=20
Lore=40 (or taunt or PP)

What about Perform?

Otherwise, very nice.

[Deleted]

I took a look at this build and moved a few things around to accomodate +14 gear because I can drop two Great Cha feats and still hit the magic sixty. The free feats let me pick up LSF Illusion and Legendary Artist (which was not implemented when you came up with the build).

Fantastic build thanks. A very stable bard with massive UUU, HMR and DoD, active search and full open lock and disable trap abilities.

59 Bard
1 Rogue
Race: Elf
- +2 DEX, -2 CON

Subrace: "Undying" (secret Beyond UltraRare)
- Never Gets XP Penalty
- STR +2, DEX +2, CON +4, INT +2, WIS +2, CHA +2, free feat: Dodge, free feat: Luck of Heroes, free feat: Great Fortitude, free feat: Iron
Will, free feat: Lightning Reflexes
- Undying receive +3 skill points per legendary level.

Starting Stats:
Str 8(10)
Con 12(10/14)
Dex 14(16/18)
Wis 8(10)
Int 16(18)
Cha 16(18)

1. Feat: Artist (free: dodge, LoH, GF, IW, LR)
2.
3. Feat: Curse Song
4. (CHA EVERY TIME)
5.
6. Feat: SF-Illusion
7.
8.
9. Feat: GSF-Illusion
10.
11.
12. Feat: SF-Transmutation
13.
14.
15. Feat: GSF-Transmutation
16.
17.
18. Feat: SF-Enchant
19.
20.
21. feat: GSF-Enchant
22.
23. b.feat: Lasting Inspiration
24. feat: Great CHA 1
25.
26. b.feat: Great CHA 2
27. feat: Great CHA 3
28.
29. b.feat: Great CHA 4
30. feat: Great cHA 5
31.
32. b.feat: Great CHA 6
33. feat: Great CHA 7
34. Rogue level - max OL, Disable Trap, Search, Set Trap +5
35.
36. feat: ESF OL, b.feat: ESF Search
37.
38.
39. feat: Metamagic-Extended Spell, b.feat: ESF Disable Trap
40.

LEGENDARY

41. Book: Necro
42. feat: ESF-Illusion
43.
44.
45. feat: ESF-Enchantment
46.
47.
48. feat: ESF-Transmutation
49.
50.
51. feat: Legendary Artist
52.
53.
54. feat: LSF Illusion
55.
56.
57. feat: Great Cha 8
58.
59.
60. feat: Legendary Luck

====================================

Skills (total skill pts= 4 + 4 (INT) + 59 (Bard Bonus) + (undying 3*LL=60)= 623 points
OL 63
DisT 63
Search 63
ST 5
Disc 63
Tumble 60
Conc 63
UMD 24
Perf 63

=====================================

Final CHA

60 = 16 (base) + 2 (subby) + 10 (lvlup) + 10 (LL) + 8 (G.CHA) + 14 (items) = 60

[lugofmany]

After a year away from HG, I find myself needing a few reworks. This build looks like just the ticket. My question pertains to the Leg Artist feat. My bard will need to take all 10 Gr CHA. It seems that I will need to replace Leg Luck with Leg Artist. So, will 52/60/56 saves be a killer ? ( If I read the OP correctly)
ty,
lug

[Deleted]

With a +14 charisma item you can do it as I posted above and retain the HUGE auras before demigod status.

[louisvilleslugger]

This build is currently x1 and awaiting a nessus run for x2. It's one of my favorite builds.

I chose to use the saves artifact on it to raise saves +3, and more importantly perhaps, it gives you 1/rest +20 skill w/ 10 round greater restore--this makes opening locks or finding secrets easy to do without the need for gear swapping (+20 bard song, +20 tymora luck=near the +50 cap).

I also have a +1 spell level bard ego item, so I can achieve the pure 60th benefits from buffing (ie. max'd EV)

If you enjoy bards, I HIGHLY recommend this build.

[kralex]

I'm building my first bard ever right now (at level forty-something atm) and am following this build, thank you louisvilleslugger for posting it, and silver for the adaptations! However, along the way some general questions about bard builds occurred to me that I'd like to ask.

Having someone in party that can do rogue duties is always nice, but I'm starting to wonder if bard is the right class to do it. There's no obvious synergy from having the right main Ability like Dex builds or Wizards/PMs (Int) do. Using Undying makes you pretty slow compared to a Shard bard. The three Epic Skill Foci could be another bard epic. Spending 300 skill points on three rogue feats leaves nothing for Taunt, Bluff, Lore, etc.

So I wonder: do rogue skills make up for the somewhat reduced barding abilities? Which would you veterans prefer in a party: bard/rogue, or a bard with maxxed out barding abilities and having to look for another searcher/picker?

[gandoron]

I think a bard with rogue skills is pretty cool, however every bard should have taunt. It's just too important. Particularly against difficult bosses.

-G

[louisvilleslugger]

Every party needs a bard. Having a bard w/ rogue skills ensures maximized loot (via secrets and chests).

Not every party has a rogue. A 'pure' rogue is really quite weak.

Yes, loot wizards do well, I can't argue that. My point is mainly that every run needs a bard, but not every run will have a loot wizard.

By doing bard and rogue duties, you really free up a spot in the party for 1 of anything (rather than specific searcher/looter).

Taunt is great btw, but disagree that it's a must.