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Post by Lastone Yusee [SL] on May 7, 2008 7:07:12 GMT
Tried to fit this to Baseborn since I don't have HA. Had to drop Dev Crit, so swapped to Scims instead for as good a crit range as I can get:
Race: Baseborn Titan Class: Paladin(39), Cleric(1) Abilies {Creation} (Subbie Modified) [60, no items]: STR: 15 (20) [40] DEX: 8 CON: 12 WIS: 14 [25] INT: 10 CHA: 16 (18) [30] Statistics: Hitpoints (40) [60 w/ items]: (438) [898] Saving Throws @ (40) [60 w/ items] (Fortitude/Will/Reflex): (30/27/22) [68/65/60] AB @ (40) [60 w/ buffs]: (38) [91] AC @ 60 w/ BURs: 126 or so Spell Casting: Paladin(4),Cleric(1) Alignment Changes: 0 Skills @ 60: Concentration 63, Discipline 63, Tumble 60, 3 spare
Not sure it has what it takes though, with only 91 AB. Interesting exercise to figure things out though. If anyone is interested in more details I can post the rest of the build, but I expect it's a bit too weak, and HA is probably the only subbie that can realistically pull this off.
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Post by mikekolba on May 7, 2008 10:27:53 GMT
I originally tried this in the tester with Baseborn Titan also and found the same...
Came to the Conclusion that only feasable way to do it was with Hound Archon because the STR would be too low otherwise using any other subbies. Also sacrificing on Skill points which can hurt...
Maybe an outside shot of doing it with Half-Celestial because it would have such a high starting Wis and CHA, but not sure since it loses a smite feat and the starting STR would be a few points lower...
BTW- happy to have generated some interest and good dialog with this build. I know it's a "stretch" build, kinda like my Warchanter, but I think that's also what makes it more interesting and provides some character/build diversity...
Sometimes with a BUR subbie, you can do something unconventional as opposed to "Max Tooning" and still have it work ok...
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Post by shadow on May 7, 2008 18:13:31 GMT
well for the baseborn titan version I would dump con by 2 and pick up 2 more int and max out craft weapon...that will net you at least another point of ab or more depending on your setup and the hell pens. IMO hp is vastly overrated ^_^ And 91 ab is a perfectly respectable amount...it will hit everything post curse (which is the only world tanks want to be in right???) I would also be interested to see the rest of the build ^_^
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Post by mikekolba on May 7, 2008 23:11:09 GMT
Lets see the rest of baseborn titan if you get a minute... I'm curious... When I did it in the tester originally, the STR was kinda low (lower than my HA here...)
Also, Acaos was nice enough to confirm that Planar Turning can be taken in LL's just as long as you qualify for it...
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Post by Lastone Yusee [SL] on May 8, 2008 1:15:01 GMT
Ok, I'll post the rest of the BT build when I get to work tonight. Also, essentially the same build can be done with FA.
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Post by mikekolba on May 8, 2008 10:34:14 GMT
I can't see any issues with the progression that Kobra posted after testing and after the Information Acaos provided (Thanks Kobra!) so I'll be using the build progression that Kobra posted with the extra CON as I don't think at this point the extra 2 STR points and +1 ab will help significantly...
Keep in mind too, this toon has a MAX taunt with the gear I outlined, so that somewhat offsets the lower AB from the Lower STR.... (and I Taunt Religiously...)
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Post by Lastone Yusee [SL] on May 9, 2008 7:06:06 GMT
Sorry, didn't get to this last night. Here is the build outline for BT:
Race: Baseborn Titan Class: Paladin(39), Cleric(1) Abilies {Creation} (Subbie Modified) [60, no items]: STR: 15 (20) [40] DEX: 8 CON: 12 WIS: 14 [25] INT: 10 CHA: 16 (18) [30]
Statistics: Hitpoints (40) [60 w/ items]: (478) [958] Saving Throws @ (40) [60 w/ items] (Fortitude/Will/Reflex): (30/27/22) [68/65/60] AB @ (40) [60 w/ buffs]: (38) [91] AC @ 60 w/ BURs: 126 or so Spell Casting: Paladin(4),Cleric(1) Alignment Changes: 0
Skills @ 60: Concentration 63, Discipline 63, Tumble 60, 3 spare
Ability Selection: - through lvl 24, all CHA (required to get 25 CHA for Great Smites) - 28-54, all WIS (required for Planar Turning at 57) - 56-58, STR - 60, CHA
Feat Selection: 01: Paladin(1): Blooded, Power Attack 03: Paladin(3): Divine Might 06: Paladin(6): Divine Shield 09: Paladin(9): Weapon Focus: Scimitar 12: Paladin(12): Improved Critical: Scimitar 15: Paladin(15): Blind Fight 18: Paladin(18): Toughness 21: Paladin(21): Epic Weapon Focus: Scimitar 23: Paladin(23): Armor Skin 24: Paladin(24): Great Charisma I 26: Paladin(26): Great Smite I 27: Paladin(27): Great Smite II 29: Paladin(29): Great Smite III 30: Paladin(30): Great Smite IV 32: Paladin(32): Great Smite V 33: Paladin(33): Great Smite VI 35: Paladin(35): Great Smite VII 36: Paladin(36): Great Smite VIII 38: Paladin(38): Great Smite IX 39: Paladin(39): Great Smite X 40: Cleric(1): Domain Destruction, Domain Evil 42: LL: LSA Tumble 45: LL: LWF Scimitar 48: LL: Great Strength 51: LL: Great Strength 54: LL: Great Strength 57: LL: Planar Turning 60: LL: Great Strength
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Post by Lastone Yusee [SL] on May 9, 2008 7:09:31 GMT
Hmm, was just thinking that you could actually move 2 points from CON to STR (making starting STR 16, and CON 10), then drop a Great STR feat and sub in Epic Prowess, netting 2 more AB, 1 less Fort save and 60 less HP. That just about makes this feasible to me...
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Post by trickypriest on Jun 11, 2008 20:37:16 GMT
How would it look with Pharlan subby?
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Post by the1kobra on Jun 12, 2008 18:56:17 GMT
I'm actually making one of these using pharlan, compared to hound archon, the differences are minor. You have 2 less stat points of either con, dex(assuming you want to raise it beyond 8), or int, but come out with 2 more strength. You also lose out on 60 HP (I didn't fit toughness), but gain levitation and pharlan SR, (instead of hound archon SR) Here is what I did Stats: 14/10/14/10/14/15 (base) 20/10/14/10/18/19 (phawwan) I figured I would be happy without as many skill points as the original build, so I decided to get tumble, discipline, and craft armor. I don't think concentration is that useful, since turning doesn't require a conc check if you get hit, and I don't think you will be casting too many spells on the front lines. As for parry, I don't think you will need it too much, your crit immunity should keep you safe for while you need it, and your parry won't be great in plate and a tower shield anyways. I thought the 2 higher dexterity would help out a bit against the DC 34 dex checks that are prevalent in the hells, though you can switch it out for int if you like. Free: Great Strength 2, Divine Might Feats/Stats: 1: Blooded 3: Blind Fight 4: Cha+1 6: Weapon Focus (I took the light flail, but you can take whatever you like) 8: Cha+1 9: Improved critical 12: Power Attack, Cha+1 15: Extra smiting 16: Cha+1 18: Cleave 20: Cha+1 (Charisma is now 24) *s mark paladin feats 21: Great-Charisma 1 23*: G-Smite 1 24: G-Smite 2 Wis+1 26*: G-Smite 3 27: G-Smite 4 28: Wis+1 29*: G-Smite 5 30: G-Smite 6 32*: G-Smite 7, Wis+1 (now 21) 33: G-Smite 8 35*: G-Smite 9 36: G-Smite 10, Wis+1 38*: Armor Skin 39: Epic Weapon Focus 40: Wis+1(23), Good Domain, Plant domain I think the plant domain is a bit more useful than the destruction domain, but I'll need to confirm with some experienced turners. Legendaries 42: LSA Tumble, Wis+1 44: Wis+1 45: Planar Turning 46: Str+1 48: LWF, Str+1 50: Str+1 51: Epic Prowess 52: Str+1 54: G-Cleave, Str+1 56: Str+1 57: OV Crit 58: Str+1 60: DV Crit, Str+1 Ending stats: 42/10/14/10/25/29 54/22/26/22/37/41 Notes: 1: Dev crit is an expensive investment. you can drop it for 3 Legendary feats and 2 pre epic feats. 1 of the pre epics can go to toughness, and the other can go to extra turning. Since you're a half-elf base, you can take LSA Listen, though of course you would want your INT higher if you did this, and take the last two points and put them into strength. 2: You can take off 2 points of STR and put them in to evening out your wisdom and charisma, but I don't reccomend this. 3: Juggling your dex, con, and int scores can be tricky. You get 10 points for all of them. If you take the swaps listed in note 1, you might be able to relax con a bit, you get 958 HP total ending with the primary version. 4: You need not worry about malebranches since pharlans auto lev, though KD if your bard is busy can be an issue. In hells, you will want to stun Erinyes as quickly as possible, since they are your main threat, there is no defense against their domination that you have, especially if you start with an 8 dexterity.
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Post by mikekolba on Jun 14, 2008 16:29:07 GMT
Kobra,
I think I would agree on plant domain since the CHA is generally low (although once in a while a construct in hell will roll a 1 and you will destroy it) or could take elemental domain to stun fumes/colds...
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Post by StrykerOfChaos on Jun 22, 2008 0:12:11 GMT
Minor note...the last cha point you put in doesn't do anything for you. (Turning adds cha mod so 49 cha does nothing. Referring to level 21 of Kobra's version.) You could in Blind Fight.
-Stryker
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Post by the1kobra on Jun 22, 2008 2:01:08 GMT
25 base charisma is a prerequisite for the smiting feats and planar turning. I also took blind fight at level 3. I would have evened it out to 26, but I did not have the room, unless I wanted to dock strength which I felt was already low enough.
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Post by StrykerOfChaos on Jun 22, 2008 2:39:35 GMT
You take it at...45? Switch planar turning to 48 and put LWF at 45. You get +1cha per 5 pally levels. ^_^ What's three more levels?
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Post by mikekolba on Aug 17, 2008 3:49:14 GMT
Demi'd today. Woot!
Mike
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