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Post by Acaos on May 20, 2009 0:09:57 GMT
I'm thinking of actually suggesting it as a rare boss drop in a post-Hells area. One that has to do with chaos ... Acaos
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Post by dodrudon on May 20, 2009 0:24:11 GMT
Given such sufficient rarity, I'm fine with it. From an RP standpoint though, I feel every subrace should fill some sort of niche, have it's own flavor, in the way the Ogre is dumb and slow, or a Salamander has fire immunity when it makes such a good BFM. Even though I min/max, limitations such as these make planning the min/maxing fun (except when it comes to Negatai, I hate Negatai *sigh*).
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Post by Shakua on May 20, 2009 1:37:02 GMT
i REALLY like this idea. only option for customized wings is a pharlan which is just not suitable for everything i want to build
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Post by Eethen on May 20, 2009 8:57:23 GMT
Is it just me, or are Protean characters not as strong as some other subraces:
Pharlan: Great strength I/II, list A Divine might, list C (?) SR 15 +1/lvl, list C (?) Strider, list C
Kolyarut Different (better?) stats
Half-Kyton Imp SpellResist 1&2, 2 epic feats, list A (?) Dodge, Mobility, list B +8 Hide, ~list D +8 Move Silent, ~list D +10Tumble, list D
Erinyes Point Blank Shot, list C (ore together with rapid shot list B) Rapid Shot, list C WpnFocus Longbow - Epic WpnFocus Longbow, List B Strider, List C
Half-Celestial SpellFocusEvo, GreaterSpellFocusEvo, List B EpicSkillHeal, List C SR10+1/lvl, ~List C Strider, list C
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Post by Avissar on May 20, 2009 9:12:03 GMT
That's probably the point if you straight-up compare Protean to already existing BUR sub-races. However, there are certainly class combinations that could benefit from a customizable race. And even though Rilmani might be the "better race" for a druid, the ability to add custom wings to my druid is worth it in my opinion.
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Post by Trazik on May 20, 2009 9:27:05 GMT
One could, for example, make a zen ranger with +6 Wisdom, +great Wis 1 and 2 as start feats, and exceed the existing DC cap. Likewise for a pure Wizard or Sorc.
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Post by StrykerOfChaos on May 20, 2009 9:48:10 GMT
One could, for example, make a zen ranger with +6 Wisdom, +great Wis 1 and 2 as start feats, and exceed the existing DC cap. Likewise for a pure Wizard or Sorc. how would that exceed any cap when you can take Genie, Rilm, HC, Negatai etc and then just take Great Wis,Int, Cha, X ..there is no difference and is actually down one feat in comparison, as most of them get 3 feats not two.
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Post by Trazik on May 20, 2009 9:55:58 GMT
In many builds, Great <stat> 10 comes with a sacrifice. Sometimes it's a reduced number of epic spells or Legendary Spell Foci, sometimes it's other feats. A Protean character may not necessarily have to make such tough choices.
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Post by simpetar on May 20, 2009 12:22:05 GMT
One could, for example, make a zen ranger with +6 Wisdom, +great Wis 1 and 2 as start feats, and exceed the existing DC cap. Likewise for a pure Wizard or Sorc. To actually exceed the existing DC cap, a zen ranger would have to have 74 wisdom (modifier 32) which is afaik not possible for a player character. But I do get your point, my zen ranger (gnome anarch) has only Great Wisdom VIII, because I felt Discipline and saves were more important than 1 AB. I really like the idea, crafting a BUR subrace to your taste is just wonderful (just tried a Protean arcane theurge 15 cleric / 25 wizard on paper, just out of curiosity, and was quite impressed). Furthermore, such item would surely diversify the highest tier item trades, I admit I am bored or infinite articles "LF: PW ring, FT: 7 Koly books + 3 Stronghearts", etc. cheers simpetar
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Post by Shakua on May 20, 2009 13:31:42 GMT
The race shouldnt be perfect anyways compared to other burs, otherwise everyone would want a protean and none the others would want the regular bur races, so im fine if its a feat down from a pharlan or kolyrut. But there a great deal of flexibility here. Some examples: i just build a pharlan zen ranger just for the wings and tail . With a choosing of stats a set up of +6 wisdom +4 str +2 con -2 cha and pick package 1, (a and d, this would get me great wisdom 1 2 and custom wings) allowing me to fit all great wisdoms in vs the +4 str +4 wisdom +4 cha 1 2 str and sandwalking)
This would also make a perfect choice for a bur theurge race since there are no suitable bur races currently. a set up of +6 int +4 wisdom for wiz control ones, +6 wisdom +4 int for cleric control ones or just a plain +4 +4 +4 set up, putting that extra +4 where you want + spell focus feats would be idea, might actualy see somebody playing a theurge after that.
The only thing that does seem off is package B with 2 feats that a normaly only available at level 1. a human based one then could get 3 starter feats (one of them being blooded or bullheaded) and i assume most builds take blooded if they not control class assassin monk and afew others making it easier to take save feats (luck of heros anyone?)
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Post by starlandra on May 20, 2009 19:08:59 GMT
I LOVE IT
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Post by fasut on May 21, 2009 8:47:51 GMT
it would be nice if even rare and ultra-rare version of this subrace exist.
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Post by Shakua on May 21, 2009 10:26:32 GMT
nah should be left bur, otherwise rare and ur subraces woudnt be used that much
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Post by Yojimbo on May 21, 2009 13:06:14 GMT
Yes this only works as a single use BUR drop anything else would be too good.
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Post by Shakua on May 21, 2009 14:42:26 GMT
i could see this run being called a lot too (or done alot quietly and small groups) course i would expect lots of chaotic gear too >.>
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