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Post by Rain on Jan 22, 2011 17:59:21 GMT
Introduction:I know there're some Stormlords around though not many actually in action due to very poor damage. So I managed to combine the steady damage output from a Dragon focused shapechanger with the extra attacks and nice buffs from Stormlord, thus here comes this build: What I have in this build: -- Very solid Defense: 80Str/50Dex, 139AC at x1demi, Epic Dodge, Evasion, 48% concealment, Max'ed Parry skill for Crit reduction -- Insane Saves: 71/69/74 at x2demi -- True Fear/Disease Imm (Paladin bonus) -- True Poison Imm (Con Arti) -- Decent Offensive power: 10 Attacks per round: 6(base) +1(haste) +2(SoV) +1(Flurry); Epic Weapon specialization + Superior Critical. High strength bonus damage + Dragon claw elemental damage + Dragon Breath. -- 2x Greater Ruin/rest, Epic Mage Armor -- 3 Druid Epic spells: 1> Elemental Shunt2> Immutable Force3> Veil of the Mists(+20Natural AC) ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- the Build: 55Druid/4Paladin/1Monk ( paladin lvl chosen any lvl before epic and monk at 40) Race/Subrace: Human/ Half-KytonAlignment: Neutral Good Stats bonus: 9 goes to Wisdom, 11 goes to Dex. "Half-Kyton" (secret Beyond UltraRare) - FC: Base Race, Monk - DEX +4, WIS +4, CON +4, free feat: Improved Spell Resistance 1, free feat: Improved Spell Resistance 2, free feat: Dodge, free feat: Mobility, +8 hide, +8 move silent, +10 tumble, speaks Infernal Starting stats at lvl1 : Str:8 Dex:16 (20 after subby change) Con:12 (16 after subby change) Int:14 Wis:16 (20 after subby change) Cha:8 Feats: before Epic: Blooded Extended Spell Spell Focus: Illusion Greater Spell Focus: Illusion Weapon Focus: Unarmed Strike Improved Critical: Unarmed Strike Power Critical: Unarmed Strike Spell Focus: Evocation from lvl 20-40: Armor Skin Epic spell focus:Illusion Epic Prowess Epic Weapon Focus: Unarmed Strike Greater Spell Focus: Evocation Epic Spell: Greater ruin Epic Spell: Epic Mage Armor Epic Druid feats: Greater Wisdom I Epic Spell Focus: Evocation Dragon Shape Legendary feats: LSA: Tumble Legendary Form Focus: Dragon Shape I - III Legendary Weapon Focus: Unarmed Strike Superior Critical: Unarmed Strike Epic Weapon specialization: Creature Weapon Tome: Transmutation (at lvl 41) Consumed Artifact: Orb of the Dragonkin (Con artifact) Pandect: Craft Armor ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Skill Points(at lvl 60): Animal Empathy: 63 Discipline: 43 Parry: 63 Craft Armor: 63 Tumble: 60 Spellcraft: 50 Listen: 43 Concentration: 52 Final Saves at lvl 60 double demi(with +14stats): Fort: 71 Reflex: 69 Will: 74 AC = 10(base) +20(dex bonus ac) +18(armor ac) +12(shield ac) +20(deflection ac from asmo arti)+ 20(natural ac) +20(dodge ac) +12(tumble ac) +2(armor skin) +3(craft armor) + 2(girding)= 139AC AB: 101/98/95/92/89/86 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ As always, all feedback and suggestion welcome.
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Post by Torin on Jan 22, 2011 18:25:36 GMT
I must say, from the numbers this is really cool.
Druids get Venom Immunity at level 9, wouldn't this cover the poison immunity?
The damage in elec and +15 in LL from Storm Lord ably to hand attacks?
Its a "shapechanger tank", right? So, doesn't only Wisdom matter or I'm wrong here?? confused...
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Post by Rain on Jan 22, 2011 18:32:06 GMT
Druid Poison immunity doesn't cover the lot of insta kill poison in Hells, also paladin has Disease imm.
Stormlord doesn't have any bonus elec damage so far I know, at least not applied atm.
Yes, you can call it a shifter, but in human form my ac is actually higher: 141 as a non-demi(light armor+shield). Anyway, to be a Dragon Stormlord, you have to reach the base 31Dex and 30 Wis. Wisdom doesn't actually boost AC in Dragon shape, Dex does instead.
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Post by Balduvard on Jan 22, 2011 18:39:52 GMT
Stormlord doesn't have any bonus elec damage so far I know, at least not applied atm. The only bonus damage Stormlords receive is if they use a weapon that they have cast Shock Weapon on (2 additional dice for a maximum bonus of 6 dice). Considering my predilection for playing melee builds, this is an appealing idea for a Druid.
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Post by Rain on Jan 22, 2011 18:54:16 GMT
Ah, didnot know their shock weapon has 2 more dice. the Screenie is just a toon in the test chamber without any weapon. Right, guess I totally forgot about the Epode thing. I've never played shifter on HG, so what stats you can get from wildshape LL3 foci? My DC is quite low atm with only base 30 wisdom. Except dragon breath for damage, I don't really plan to use the wingbuffet much since dc is only 45. Maybe useful in desperate party against fumes
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Post by Balduvard on Jan 22, 2011 19:04:39 GMT
I found that Druids get Wildshape (animals), not Greater Wildshape (useful things), so while you could get LFF3 Wildshape and Dragon...the former would be rather useless.
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Post by Yojimbo on Jan 22, 2011 20:06:11 GMT
I thought I had read that Druid's innate Venom immunity granted them the same poison immunity as the CON arti.
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Post by Torin on Jan 22, 2011 20:31:03 GMT
There is still so much mysterious for me on the shapechangers...
- How is AB calculated? - How are the stats altered by shapechanging?
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Post by maljin on Jan 22, 2011 21:34:56 GMT
Torin probably meant the damage bonus from stormlord's storm of vengeance:
Storm of Vengeance - This spell does CLd8 per round to all enemies in the area. - When cast as a Druid spell by a caster with at least 30 base Dexterity and whose base Dexterity is higher than their base Wisdom, casts Storm Avatar instead. Storm Avatar grants all the bonuses of the Divine Power spell, plus a physical damage bonus of 1 for every casterlevel above 40.
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Post by chirality on Jan 23, 2011 0:16:01 GMT
maljin suggested trying a Stormlord with my newly-acquired Wraith subbie after some discussion last night (the night before? I dunno), and although I more or less shot him down rudely I've been thinking about the possibility of trying this. I'm attracted to this under-used and, to many, underpowered "quasi" (technically more of a druid variant ... would be nice to see some extras added to this and a "true" quasi emerge) for several reasons, and right now--without going into detail on why--it seems like it might be a fun and attractively-unexpected possibility for Wraith. Anyway... I suppose this would more properly be suited to its own thread but I'm interested in this build in particular, as despite using Half-Kyton it seems more easily-adaptable to a "lesser" non-BUR subbie than the other stormlord builds I've looked at. I'd like to think I'm at least well-acquainted enough with a lot of what I see as "basics" to be fully aware of the differences between attempting a build like this with Wraith and replicating Rain's actual build. So, without asking for (or even desiring) to have these pointed out to me...what do you guys think about trying to make a build like this for Wraith? What I mean, to clarify, is a stormlord build more like this one than the other builds posted. It seems to me like trying to work the shifting angle might be the best way for me to try to get a decent stormlord without having a multi-dem, BUR-subbie toon with an artifact of choice lying around. That said, keep in mind that any such toon I built would be hardcore. The only other secret subbie I have is Thri-Kreen, and although there are many obvious reasons why that would make for a better version of this build than Wraith, I also don't like some of the cons, and optimization reasons aside, I simply do not want to make another Thri-Kreen toon right now. Mainly, I'm looking at the Wraith extras as allowing me to ditch the paladin levels (maybe replace with 2 [Edit: would need 3 for Divine Power...hrm, maybe replace with 4 fighter levels unless saves were too important] bg levels instead for saves) and still keep the fear and disease immunities that I value so highly. Str pen would hurt but the Dex would be nice; I'm thinking there are pros and cons for several various base races as a choice. Anyway...any ideas here? I'm not that familiar at all with shapechangers (neither shifters not plain 'ol druids) and I see this as a way to play one in a fashion that I'd find enjoyable. So any comments on the possibility of trying this "dragon" stormlord version with Wraith? And Rain--I think this looks like a really nice build; I like it a lot better (at least on paper) than other stormlord builds I've looked at. No offense or criticism intended for the creators of the other stormlord builds; I just mean for my preferences I like this a lot more. Looks solid and fun to me. Edit: After doing a bit of preliminary research, here's some quick thoughts: --Drop the Bioware epics in favor of more Great Wisdom feats --If it wouldn't prove to be too damaging as far as overall saves go, replace paladin levels with fighter for some extra much-needed feat slots --Everything else *more or less* basically the same, save for necessary tweaks due to differences arising from subrace differences; in particular starting attribute point distribution would obviously be much different. --Int is what I see as the least important attribute here so I'd be sacrificing that over the rest; resulting in drastically lowered skill points; would drop Spellcraft and then Heal if needed. --If needed drop the Power/Superior Critical line in favor of something else; obviously hard to say without being sure of inclusion of fighter levels or not (I'm thinking possible replacement are save feats, Spell Foci....shrug).
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Post by Rain on Jan 23, 2011 6:44:08 GMT
Just took a further look into this build, a few things I wanna point out as a self note and modify: 1. It's impossible to get Superior Crit before LL as I can't actually get 23 dex by lvl 40. If you're really into it, you can however drop EWS for Sup Crit then free up one pre-LL feat at your disposal. So with the extra free feat poping into my head, I'm actually thinking of going Pharlan for Divine Might, but at a cost of no LSA: Discipline. though in return, I'll have LSA:Listen as an half-elf and sleep immunity. 2. I totally forgot cha bonus adds to Saves with demi stats bonus, so the saves are actually much crazier at x2demi with +14stats: 71/69/74. And also a quick reply to some of Chirality's thoughts: 1. More wisdom doesn't really help, in the contrary, it weakens the build. To be a Stormlord, you need higher base Dex than base Wis, and since when you shift, you base dex doesn't matter at all, that's why I said 31dex and 30Wis is what you really want. 2. Greater Ruin I definately don't wanna drop, you can even cast in in dragon form. Too helpful in hells and abyss. EMA is droppable, but tbh stats are quite overrated on this build: str is useless, dex and wis 31/30 are enough respectively, problly con or cha(if you go pharlan and use divine might) are the real useful stats. 3. Fighter is obviously inferior to Paladin even if saves are overrated on this build: Pally has True Fear Imm(VERY important in abyss and aboleth), True Disease Imm(useful in hell only atm but I know it's gonna be very important in the coming Elder Evils); Fighter gives you 4 Free Combat feats before lvl 20, tbh 4 free combat feats before epic on this build is quite useless considering it's already rich in pre-Epic feats already even with Pally splash. 4. Int is not least important(well Str is . Even if I have to say this build is quite rich in Skill points, still the skills I chose in the build is never a waste. Spellcraft 50 is a must for 2 Greater Ruin/rest. Heals is important because as a only lvl 55 Druid, Monstrous Regen/Regen/Healing Circle are about one of the few buffs you wanna use, and Heal skill boosts their power. Though personally I problly will just drop a few Int for Cha. Anyway I will go into the build later when I get back home and try how Pharlan works with divine might.
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Post by chirality on Jan 23, 2011 8:24:38 GMT
Just to clarify: My "quick thoughts" were specifically in regards to my potential attempt at making a version of this build for Wraith. They definitely weren't suggestions for your actual build.
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Post by Torin on Jan 23, 2011 12:17:07 GMT
Or Elf and max tumble, what ever with able learner.
Zeny: Does the bonuses from Weapon Spez (Unarmed) ably to dragon, or mustn't it be Weapon Spez (creature) like Anarch get?
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Post by Rain on Jan 23, 2011 15:55:11 GMT
Finalized the build after a test. A few modification:
- Used one druid epic feat for ESF:Evocation so I can steal another epic feat.
- Max'ed Animal Empathy skills which I forgot earlier. It is very essential for dragon breath damage.
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Post by Balduvard on Jan 23, 2011 19:40:23 GMT
Your ability distributions should be 9 wis / 11 dex to reach 30 / 31, not 8 / 12.
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