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Post by CataclysmicDeath on May 1, 2013 22:16:47 GMT
Hmm am thinking of moving it to Wiki tbh but no idea how heh. Might post another thread to ask ;p Cata Well, we can add the shifter information on the monster data - i.e. their vulnerabilities (stoning, level drain) even if they have high SR. Something like: "Excruxiarchs" have high SR, but are susceptible to stoning. Could do, might be the easiest way to do it. Cata
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Post by tomaan on May 2, 2013 17:37:16 GMT
Well, I'm a little late to the party, but, since a shifter tank is one of my most successful builds, I'll throw my $.02 in:
I play a Ranger CC tank with only Humanoid and Undead. It's a late bloomer (lvl 50-55), mostly because you don't get shield AC until LLs, but it's very stable in Hells and Abyss. You have a form for every need (str tank, dex tank, uni tank, and ranged) and Ranger CC means very good ABs (enough to disarm most mobs).
The biggest advantage for me, however, is the Ranger spells. For example: A high wisdom modifier and Polymorph Self: Pixie will completely eliminate hells AC penalties at all levels...even at x1 demi. Polymorph:Troll regen is wisdom-based as well -- with decent gear, you can get it up 60/70pts. You also get standard ranger spells like concealment, weapon buff, FOM, etc.
Another big benefit is that you can wear heavy armor without the penalties to skills/dex modifier while shifted. I think there's a stacking weapon damage exploit as well (before shifted+after shifted). I reported it, but never really checked the logs to confirm.
The sacrifice, of course is on CL -- you don't really get a decent DC on undead spells until double demi. Even then, you'll won't be a mass killer like a pure shifter or caster in Hells or Abyss...only on LL runs. You can't use a form epode the way I built mine (42 Ranger levels for better spells), but you could still do one with 19R/5Dr/16Sh and use the epode. Since it's not a caster, however, I think the benefits of going this route are minimal.
There was a time when I thought about reincarnating into a caster shifter, but now this is one of my favorite builds.
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Post by Torin on May 2, 2013 17:43:48 GMT
Quick question: Does Ranger Blade Thirst shift over to weapons?
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Post by tomaan on May 2, 2013 17:47:00 GMT
Quick question: Does Ranger Blade Thirst shift over to weapons? Yes, so does Bane of Enemies, but the max damage bonus you can get is 3d
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Post by Mister Pin on May 2, 2013 22:14:21 GMT
Thanks Tomaan for your " $.02" But worthwhile to think about. For now tho i will stick with what i have in mind, but i won't forget this build- it does sound interesting ! Have you ever thought of posting it? Pin
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Post by desocupado on May 2, 2013 23:27:41 GMT
He have posted it under Ranger build (since CC is ranger) I made a couple of builds similar to his. One is A Shifter CC and the other is a Ranger CC.
The Shifter CC (Cunning shifter) has Ranger splash 5 for BAB 16, Employing Humanoid, Undead and Wildshape - It has Maximum DC (But CL 55 - tough PL is 60) - Quite a fun build The other build, Iron Chimera, was more for a concept. A Ranger with just humanoid shapes but next to no Wisdom or DC. It focuses on getting higher AB and a ridiculously high Constitution score/saves. If I remember correctly, Tomaan's build sacrifices 2 DC (Just Great Wisdom VI) due low amount of epic bonus feats it gets. However it gets Undead shapes as well. And Good AB (tough lousy CL)
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Post by Mister Pin on May 4, 2013 19:01:29 GMT
Thanks for the correction, i did not think to look under ranger for the build ( doh! )
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Post by Yojimbo on May 9, 2013 0:01:56 GMT
Question why are most shifters 10 Druid 1 Monk 29 Shifter while Im not sure there is a bonus at Shifter 30 it seems only 5 Druid levels is required so why not do 9 Druid 1 Monk 30 Shifter? What about doing 1 level splash of Ranger instead of Monk I know if means no Tumble dump but just wondering about why these don't seem to be done.
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Post by desocupado on May 9, 2013 0:15:27 GMT
Most shifters are Druid 10 Shifter 29 Monk 1 to use the skill dump at level 40 for Parry and Discipline 43 (which tends to be enough usually) Blooded+ LSA Tumble is worth 2 feats, even with monk splash allowing to dump "40" - the exception is using Elves' Able learner. ----
The other option, with Ranger levels focuses consider 4 things: 1 - Shifters get a bonus epic feat every 3 levels after 10, so the best option for shifter level would be 28 or 25 (however Ranger levels cost CL, but not PL) 2 - In order to have BAB 16 (and an extra attack) one should get Ranger 4 Druid 8 Shifter 8 3 - Ranger get an bonus feat at level 1-5-10-15-20 (GSF or Favored Enemy), however at epic levels it also includes additional options : bane of enemies, blinding speed, epic prowess, epic spell focus, epic toughness, epic weapon focus, improved combat casting, perfect health 4 - Rangers can access both Discipline and Parry, which shifters need at least 43.
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Post by tomaan on May 9, 2013 15:54:02 GMT
Question why are most shifters 10 Druid 1 Monk 29 Shifter while Im not sure there is a bonus at Shifter 30 it seems only 5 Druid levels is required so why not do 9 Druid 1 Monk 30 Shifter? What about doing 1 level splash of Ranger instead of Monk I know if means no Tumble dump but just wondering about why these don't seem to be done. If memory serves, you used to get monk wisdom AC while shifted -- if you're looking at an older build, that may be why. Don't you also get unarmed weapon progression with the monk level too?
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Post by desocupado on May 9, 2013 16:04:10 GMT
Since I started playing in this server, shifters never received Wisdom AC while morphed. However, they do get Unarmed progression (which can offset BAB +-14 with 14/14/13/13/10/7/4/1 - haste + LFF extra attack). Flurry of Blows also work (Keep in mind only Demonflesh golem and leonal are worth it)
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Post by Yojimbo on May 10, 2013 13:56:34 GMT
It was more why is the splash not taken out of Druid but deso answered I wasn't thinking about when it was being taken where the plash is often done on L40 to dump skills.
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Post by Mister Pin on May 13, 2013 11:33:10 GMT
I have my shifter now at 50- Yay new gear! I formatted it 29/10/1 shifter/druid/monk, taking construct/undead . Looking back on this- i guess i missed it somewhere, the monk ac is lost in the build when donning other than robes etc. My mistake, and because of the way i built it, (reinc. a 40 toon and got it as fast as i could from immo etc. to the current level), i will continue on with it, but at the 3 month opportunity will reinc. AGAIN to druid/shifter/other than monk. Maybe bard as suggested earlier. Going ranger would be a waste with Hvy. Armor prof. ( again, losing ac bonus if using it iirc.,) Ah well, yet another lesson learned in not COMPLETELY looking over everything. My fault. But i do have to say, as weak as it is at this level, it is still enjoyable to play, and a learning experience for sure. Anyone else who makes one get ready for a different ride play-style wise. Thanks again to all who contributed, for the help and advice. Mike
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Post by desocupado on May 13, 2013 21:29:40 GMT
You need LFF Wildshape 3 to read an epode. so you have to drop either Construct, Undead or Outsider.
forget Monk AC it doesn't apply to any shape (also you should use Heavy armor for betetr ac and immunity while morphed)
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Post by Mister Pin on May 14, 2013 10:28:53 GMT
Thanks for the heads up Deso; i figured that out after attempting to read one and got the same message. I really wish i had known that in the first place, that way i wouldn't have screwed up so badly, It' prolly posted somewhere obvious though, and through my "scanning" rather than actually reading, i missed it. I'll not wait the 3 months to re-reincarnate it tho, just have to slog thru the lvls again. WTH, it's just a game.
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