|
Post by DoctorLove on Dec 10, 2004 13:41:40 GMT
I must say I respectfully disagree with the auto-fail/auto-success thing. First of all, since HG2 will be much more toned down, insane ACs won't be that much of a problem for builders. We won't have to worry about everyone running around with +20 Double Axes Of Uber-Killshit. Also, no matter how good someone is, they're bound to screw up sometime.. hence the auto-failure. In regards to AC, taking the auto-succeed for rolling a 20 off would hamper non-tanking classes.. sometimes theres that one boss guy in an area that a druid or a rogue or a suicidal melee crazy sorcerer can't hit, except by rolling a 20. Giving the full base attack classes the only chance to hit some creatures would make some of the classes even less appealing. But, as I said, I don't think AC will be as much of a problem in the toned down HG2.
I don't like inate DR, either. Putting that in and taking the auto-success/auto-fail out would just irk me, as I'm a fan of the P&P D&D... which this whole thing is based on.
However, the xp thing is a great idea. Spending an hour to an hour and a half per level gained isn't so bad. But please, for the love of Zod, don't make it as slow as other MMORPGs.
Also, I read somewhere on the NWN Vault (I think) an interesting tidbit about bags of holding. Basically, information for each inventory screen (including the ones in the bags of holding) is stored on the server, and each time the inventory and bags are opened, the player has to access the server for that information. With 32 people, 6 inventory screens, 4 bags of holding each, swapping around inventory like crazy has potential to cause a good amount of server lag. I'd suggest limiting access to items like bags of holding. While it may be an inconvenience, it might make things run a bit more smoothly.
Also, running off the P&P ideas, I'd like to see a chance for players to be able to "craft" magical items. It would be limited to spellcasting classes only, as they'd be the only ones able to enchant items. So, if Troutslapper the Wizard wanted to make a magic ring/want/staff/rod/armor/weapon, he could get abilities enchanted to it based on spells in his class. Doing so would cost gold, as well as xp, and have level restrictions imposed. This could make spellcasters marketable as a player class, as well as give them a bit of an edge in a world where uber-items aren't readily available. Plus, with the associated costs in gold and experience, they wouldn't just be pumping them out like mad, if they ever wanted to buy heal potions or level again. While it seems it could get messy or complicated, I'd be willing to take the helm for the project... players would just have to communicate with me (in or out of game) to let me know what they want, I'll say if it's possible and how much it will cost. I could either come up with a new formula or adapt the formula for P&P D&D to figure the costs. I think it would be fun, rewarding, and hey.. who wouldn't want to make a personalized item? This would be similar to blacksmith upgrading, but with a bit more flavor, and not everyone could do it. Let me know what you guys think about it.
I should get back to work... the boss is looking at me funny...
-Doc
|
|
|
Post by Anonalbe on Dec 11, 2004 0:50:05 GMT
Aye, but at 1/4 AC the highest you'd ever see is between 20-25 innate reduction, and that's on a lvl 40 DEX monk who wouldn't be able to hurt stuff too much without uber items. It would end up not being a lot of reduction, just some to make higher lvl chars not take the same damage as low-lvl ones.
But if you don't like it, I can see where you're coming from, as well.
|
|
|
Post by Korbasil on Dec 11, 2004 5:27:38 GMT
Hey guys - new member so go easy! After playing on original PoA and now HG, it is good news indeed that you guys are creating a new world for all us droogs to enjoy - Great work all around! One thing I have noticed is that there are general trends that develop after a while of everyone learning the way the server works and plays. Not in a bad way, but just naturally. So, in that note, I would like to see a balancing of items and areas based on making any class or style useful. I know - this IS what you guys try and do, but its tough... So maybe the answer would be to have areas or buildings that only certain level players and/or classes could access to enter or buy equipment, etc. I don't know if its possible, but I would like to see, for example, that only a player with 15 levels of mage could access the Mage Master's Scroll Shop, or say only a player with 10 levels in WM could wield the Mighty Meaty Great Axe... this would stop the useful but not resonable one level of rogue to use UMD, or one level of sorc to access all those lovely scrolls... Or maybe a few towns scattered across the land that you have to fight to get to that only higher levels could reach, and therefore have better/different items for sale there. One more thing I was hoping for - maybe an Evil starting area (Baddyville) that is different than the Good area (goodyville) with a zone in the middle that accepts all (neutral starting point). That way we can PvP and start Guilds and make battles, raid and plunder villages... MAYBE? PS. anyone seen a Barbarian lately? some classes need some help to make them appealing again...
|
|
|
Post by Anonalbe on Dec 11, 2004 9:23:26 GMT
It looks like starting areas are gonna be split by class, not alignment. And yes, I was partying with a good barb last night.
|
|
|
Post by DoctorLove on Dec 11, 2004 20:33:15 GMT
Aye, but at 1/4 AC the highest you'd ever see is between 20-25 innate reduction, and that's on a lvl 40 DEX monk who wouldn't be able to hurt stuff too much without uber items. It would end up not being a lot of reduction, just some to make higher lvl chars not take the same damage as low-lvl ones. I think once the server is toned down and balanced a bit, we won't have to worry about having to have uber items to be effective. In reference to the current HG, a lot of the creatures were extremely tough. So, I created a crapload of items available for sale to make it a little easier. As the server evolved, characters found how to mix and match the uber equipment out there, and we as DMs had to create disgustingly powerful monsters to be even somewhat of a threat to characters. I think this happened because PoA was originally non-epic (I think this is true.. if not, my bad), and when they tried upgrading it to be epic, they didn't do that terribly great of a job. Since we're building this from the ground up, we already have a sense of natural progression, and there is a much smaller chance of everything ending up overpowered and out of whack. As for higher level characters taking less damage than lower level ones, wouldn't this kinda be represented in hit points? A level 1 with 10 hit points stuck with a sword takes 1d8 damage, and that hurts. A level 2 with 18 hit points gets struck with the same sword, and it hurts less. Now, innate DR for higher levels would mean the level 1 takes 1d8 damage to his 10 hit points, and the level 2 takes 1d8-2 to his 18 hit points. Just a pseudo-abstract example, btw, but you get the idea. -Doc
|
|
|
Post by Korbasil on Dec 13, 2004 4:21:44 GMT
More items for consideration:
(BTW - I say these things in ignorance of if they are possible or practical).
1. Something other than helmets for our heads. Maybe have mage hats or headbands for those who think wearing an iron pot on their head does not fit their character.
2. An "ID all things in inventory" option in shops instead of having to ID 10 of the same potion separately.
3. Sorry, don't get mad but... VERY limited rez and heal scrolls/rods/pots so that healers can really be used for what they are good at.
4. NO SHOUTING.
5. No porting to party - I LOVE this option and use it ALL the time, but for all the wrong reasons... lazy, etc.
|
|
|
Post by Anonalbe on Dec 13, 2004 6:29:17 GMT
1. Agree but not sure it's possible unless it's already in PRC.
2. No idea
3. They will be
4. Filter your chat window if you don't want to see shouts.
5. not really practical in a large world with no means of transportation besides running, IMO
|
|
|
Post by FormerAdmin on Dec 13, 2004 7:14:25 GMT
#5) There will be no teleportation to party: kiss that lazy option goodbye. People will be able to teleport from town to town (at a price via merchant), as well as obtain special teleportation devices via questing. We are really thinking outside the box on HG II.
|
|
|
Post by Sevrlyph on Dec 13, 2004 16:32:42 GMT
I've seen some stuff on the vault with portals that can only be used once you have been to them. Also, instead of charging gold to be ported I had the idea of each portal being guarded by a spirit and the spirit requires some of your life essence (xp) to use the portal. The amount of xp would be based on level (example. 10xp per level). You could put a portal like every 3rd outdoor zone, none inside dungeons. It would save running across the world but prevent skipping through a dungeon to meet up with friends.
You can change the looked of helms with the craft armor skill. You can turn a pot helm into a hood if you want.
Another thing I saw on a server was guild communication devices. This could be used automatically if you die, your friends would know when wand where so they could come for your corpse, if you are having persistant corpses.
|
|
|
Post by FormerAdmin on Dec 13, 2004 19:07:01 GMT
I'm not interested in an XP portal system, or any portal system besides the one the DM team has already decided upon: restricted teleportation to towns only, with few teleportation devices for "special" areas.
Gameplay is going to require exploration and pathfinding, an experience completely absent from PoA.
|
|
|
Post by MurphysLawAgain on Dec 14, 2004 17:41:23 GMT
Hiya all (1st post so be kind). Just a thought re teleport to party. I think that it prevents some lag because people don't run through areas (using invis) to get to their friends. As a result they are spawning (and not killing) as they go. Just a thought
|
|
|
Post by DoctorLove on Dec 14, 2004 18:29:20 GMT
I believe theres a despawn script in place that eliminates anything spawned by someone just running through the area.
I know that there will be a few different starting cities based on class. Would it be possible to populate the HG2 world with some other villages/towns/cities/forts and the like, then have an option for a player to change his starting location when he or she enters the game? Just an idea.
-Doc
|
|
|
Post by MurphysLawAgain on Dec 14, 2004 21:53:13 GMT
Saw the stuff about different starting locations. Sounds good - provided they are close (ish) to each other. Otherwise all the spellcasters never meet warriors, and neither ever runs into a monk until they hit mid level. Plus newbies don't get to meet each other and get hooked on the server. If they are close together could be good - and allows different shopping / adventuring choices. Of course it means you have committed to designing far more of the starter dungeons and towns maps you brave DM's you ..... Cant wait to see it.
|
|
|
Post by FormerAdmin on Dec 14, 2004 22:49:26 GMT
No, they are not going to be close together.
Why would there be 3 major towns within close proximity? That makes absolutely no sense.
You need to drop the barriers of PoA, this is NOT PoA. You can't make judgements on the starting locations until you see things in action.
Exploration is going to be required, and I don't intend on having low levels mix together: you are supposed to stay in your town's locale until you are ready to venture out further into Luthien. Each town is going to have its own atmosphere and surrounding areas directed towards the classes of each town.
Saying newbies won't meet each other is rediculous, too. Of course they will meet each other, they just will have to wait a few levels till they can survive on their own in the lands of Luthien. Once again, this is NOT PoA, and NOT going to be a Party Only mod like PoA is.
|
|
|
Post by Grogbot on Dec 17, 2004 22:45:11 GMT
Hi gang, Some thoughts on what I'd like to see. This is what I would like to *see* and I have no idea of the NWN mechanics for doing it, but its what I like in gaming: Don't have (or rather, limit) items or encounters that make classes, class abilities, skills or feats useless. Some examples: * Dev Crit (OK, I know a decision has already been made here but this is just an example) is a really expensive build - lots of feats, minimum ability requirements and so forth, which mean if you want Dev Crit you have to plan from Level one. It is frustrating that after 25 - 30 levels you find that your character is ineffective, becuase all the bosses (and mobs) are crit immune (note - I have read the other thread - this is just an example) * Sneak attack - make it an attack, not an annoying message! (OK, I know that the raft of sneak immune critters is tied to Crit Immunity to protect from Dev Crit - but you get the message...) Why be a Assassin or Rogue when ALL enemies are immune? Constructs and Undead, yes, but others just nerf poor old rogues * Turn Undead - why do we have clerics? Look at Rhazids - the original PoA has the Undead Guards as CR35 doom knights, almost certainly with turn resist. This means for the original L20 mod, a L40 cleric *might* turn one if he is lucky (and invested in Charisma from day one). I don't want a cleric to walk around and dominate every undead encounter, but I do want a cleric (or paladin) to be better at fighting undead than a rogue or a monk or a bard - or even a fighter! * And whilst we are talking Clerics - many cleric buffs are nerfed because of "Divine resist" or "Magic resist", which are in play to protect against items (as I understand) * And further - don't allow any old character to have Divine bonus weapons or Magic bonus weapons, since this nerfs the Cleric/Paladin and the Wizard/Mage. * Items that give class abilities - why take 2-weapon fighting and ambidex as feats when you can get gloves that do the same? Why be a rogue or monk when you can get improved evasion from boots? Why be a Barbarian or Dwarven Defender when everyone has Damage Immunity or Soak Items? * Scrolls and pots - enuff said elsewhere on this - I agree! Make Brew Potion and Scribe Scroll sexy feats again! * Pets - is there anything that can be done that can make the druid / ranger animals friends (or summoned critters) useful after Level 6? As an aside, the original, vanilla, PoA started out trying to address these issues through its mix of mobs. Take the original Dread Caverns - you needed a tank to stand off the Scims, which could be taken out with Negative Energy - traps or spells. You needed rogues to get round traps. So over the full area, there were areas where one class dominated and others where they were useless. So this encouraged party play. With the current mix of items, a cleric can take down dancing scims (like in Khardilonka Lair (sorry for spelling)) by himself, or a bard with Lich Lyrics or any old wiz with Horrids. So rather than encourage partying (which I like), this encourages loot runs and item-set-hording - aspects of NWN play that are fun from time to time but not ALL the time. I'd really like to see areas and quests that require heavy reliance on each of the classes (OK, not the harper Scout ). Some more use of skills would be nice too. Sorry if these are all negative comments, everyone knows I enjoy HG though! Wouldn't be here if I didn't! Grogbot
|
|