possible problem? Maybe a solution?

[DragonChyld]

In the recent update Funly moved some of the ring pedestals and capped the ring pedestal in House M..

I see a problem with this, well maybe its not a problem, maybe it is intentional.

Newer players are now going to have a MUCH more difficult time finding higher level Immos willing to help them reach immo status. What High level toon in their right mind is gonna burn up all their rests in the Lloth area, and/or the Immo run? If they do now they have to hope that have enough charges left to get to the end of a Thid or Ssithy run, with only 10 charges now I don't see that as likely.

To be completely honest, I helped a bunch of GREEN players earlier in the day of the update grab their Lloth tag. 4 of em, and only 1 had ever even been on a Lloth run.. they were going to try to do it by themselves. The only reason whatsoever I even found this out was cause I needed a ring recharge saw they were in Lloth area and offered to help.

Because I joined I invited a few of my guild mates and we made what would have been a disaster into a successful Lloth run and got these new players their tags.

I see this scenario happening alot less not that the house M charger is capped.

If this was intentional, to get Higher level players to stop helping cats on their Lloth and Immo runs then please disregard this post. however if not I offer 2 diff suggestions.

A> Make the final Lloth area restable 1 person at a time
or
B> Place an Uncapped ring pedestal in the abyss after Immo dies

Of the 2 I think the second is a better solution as it would pressure those higher level toons who wanna help out, go on an immo run with those they just helped in Lloth with.

Just throwing my thoughts out into the wind.

~ DragonChyld

[Ironfang]

Well my problem with the new Ring Pedastel placement is this.

I am only ever able to log on and play in 1 to 2 hours spurts, so I never have time to complete the major runs. Therefore I often do Beholder runs which uses up a few charges but I will run dry and not be able to go on a 'Thid or 'Ssith run to get a recharge as I will not have enough charges to make a whole run.

Another scenario is the Pyramid which I have done a few times now but it sucks up a lot of charges so lets say I do Pyramid with 7 charges, how am I going to get to end of Ssith or 'Thids with 3 charges left?

Basically; how is the player that doesn't/can't play for 4 hours at time get a recharge?

[sabregirl]

dragonchyld said:

Newer players are now going to have a MUCH more difficult time finding higher level Immos willing to help them reach immo status.

Perhaps this is part of the point, to curtail some of the: lvl 60 blasting through lolth and immortal, dragging lvl 37s along behind, type syndrome. Seems to me there should be plenty of lowbie immortals running about and the mortals themselves should be able to stand on their own two feet. If you find yourself completely unable to handle loth/immortal maybe it's time to reexamine your build and/or your gear. The more experienced players could spend more time helping new players find better gear, rather than just dragging them to immortality.

ironfang- SSith is designed in such a way as you can always run back out to the T-chamber and rest, allowing you to complete most of the run without using many ring charges, as long as you have someone willing to hold your place. Also, if either run has already been completed you can fairly easily and quickly take a small group in and get your ring recharged without having to complete every aspect of the run.

-S

[tyranlthixis]

Really not much has changed. Except that players are discouraged from XP farming in Thids and frelling up that run for people who want to do the whole thing..... and it will be slightly more inconvenient for players to plant casters on one server and then go all out with epic spells in areas like the Pyramid.

Instead of running into thids and despawning house 2, you can find a ssissy run thats already been completed. Then sanctuary through the temple and jump into the portal and touch the pedestal. Its a safe room, so its really easy to log from there.

Generally, Lolth can be completed without "needing" a rest in no port areas. This is especially easy for level 60 wizards/sorcerer who should have lots of spell slot gear at that point. Personally, I plan to bring one of my lesser used wizards out of retirement and just using him for immortal runs and since he is under level 45 nothings really changed for him.

The one "snag" I see in all of this is the Dustbone run. It is a long run and is hard to get casters to come because most lack the gear to survive well. Now its going to be even more difficult...which means I'm going to be maging it a lot more. I don't mind maging but it means I don't get a break to use that run to gain xp on my other characters. Another pedestal would be nice in the DB treasure room. May even make the run attractive to mages..

Tyran

[cathedralmaster]

If your careful about it and have a decent party to back you, a lvl 60 caster should be able to do all of Lolths without a single ring rest, be able to do the immo run with only 3 (this is where it pays to be a sorc), and SSithraks on only 1.

As for planting characters near the ring recharge on one server, I'd say it's even more convenient now as you don't have to worry about the water ring anymore when you log back.

And for those who can't figure it out - when it comes to recharging, Greater Sanctuary is your friend. Even if you don't have it, just get a mage with a couple of minutes on his hands to despawn the way for you.

[FunkySwerve]

The main point of the moves was to stop runs from being partially despawned, preventing completion, as well as to stop some of the sillier abuses of our mustiserver setup. As already pointed out, even if you don't have access to an already completed ssith or thid run, which is hard to imagine, ssiths only take 1 or 2 ring charges to complete, because you can duck out to rest until you hit the abode. As for dusty, you will never see a ped in his horde, but there will eventually be one not far from there.
Funky

[bort]

flashheart2 said:

Personally, I don't know why we're talking about caster balance, I'm more concerned at the power of caster builds vs the power of melee builds.

More power to the melee!

[Ironfang]

I hadn't thought of a finished Sith run, that fixes my problem, I just wanted a way to recharge without a 4 hour run. If I can go into and just do temple to get charge thats cool with me.

Thanks
'Fang

[chainlink]

Would help if the Ssith pedestal didn't limit you to level 0 for recharges as I don't currently have any level 0 mages

[FunkySwerve]

chainlink said:

Would help if the Ssith pedestal didn't limit you to level 0 for recharges as I don't currently have any level 0 mages

It doesn't.
Funky

[chainlink]

Just out of interest what was the reasoning for reducing the charges from 12 to 10? Not that I've been severely affected by any of these changes recently as I've been playing RDD and AA toons but I guess I'll have to roll out my caster at some time in the near future.

[DragonChyld]

Ok since the reasoning has been explained I can't say I disagree with it, however I still think a ring ped at the end of the Immortal fight would be handy, and it would not be exploitable, as you would have to use a stone of Succor to charge a ring there.

Anyways thans or taking the time to sonsider my thoughts.

~DC

[thedomicron]

i really don't think a ring ped is worth placing at the immo fight just because its not a run that needs a lot of mages. with a nice big party, and all the non-immos who need them should have a full ring, any high level mages should only need 1 maybe 2 rests, if they don't have rings, then a biorejuvenator should work just fine

anyhow i like melee in the abyss, it just seems more fun

[maudlin27]

What is the main purpose of the rest ring out of interest? I'm currently assuming its a way of rationing a wizards rests, so they have to space out their spells on a run, essentially meaning they can rest up to 10 times on a run. However, not all runs have rest ring recharges, while those that do now have them at the end of the run. So in effect it means you are now expected to make the rest ring last for several runs, or simply not do certain runs if you're going to need to rest alot, or alternatively, as suggested, find a server where ssithy/the overmind is already dead, run over there, and recharge your ring that way. However isn't this a bit of a flaw that you actually now need one of these runs to have been done by someone else for the rest ring system to work properly? If all it is is a way of rationing rests for particular runs, then couldn't you just have a ring recharge pedestal in the boss room of each run? That way you can space out your rests properly for the run properly. As it is I can see runs like dusty being even more unpopular than they are at the moment. You only have 10 rests instead of 12 now, yet you don't get to recharge your ring at any point. The run itself is also very long and can drain quite a few rests, especially if you're not in a very strong party, or not using a powerful lev60 char with all the good caster loot equiped. The run was already fairly unpopular/underdone due to needing the hard to get hold of runes, and also the requirement for 6 different immunities with up to 5 required for a single group of enemies (although 1 of these can be gained with a potion to be fair). Now it seems people will only be going either if they have to (to get the tag to use a db weapon), or if their character is heavily reliant on db loot such as AAs (so basically, if they have to!). In contrast, runs that dont require rest rings are going to become even more popular. So basically dachy+desert runs are now in even more demand.
That's what I find puzzling about this change - runs that don't tend to be done quite so much (assuming the recent trend after the BURs of most runs being done has now died down/will go once the hells open for business) such as the pyramid, dusty, and to a lesser extent beholders, are going to be even more unpopular. Ssithy and illithids will probably remain about the same - you have fewer rests for the runs, but also get to recharge your ring - while the two most popular runs on the server, dachy and the desert (both of which tend to have been done/in the process of being done under an hour from a server reset) are going to be in even greater demand.

While I can see why the pedestals may have been moved to boss areas to deal with despawning issues, I can't see why the charges on the rest rings needed to be reduced as well if that was the main aim - if anything this will increase the number of people looking to recharge their rings. Was the reason for this more of a balancing change to make life tougher for casters (and as a result relatively easier for melees/chars requiring few rests), or have I missed something in the effect this will have?

[FunkySwerve]

maudlin27 said:

However isn't this a bit of a flaw that you actually now need one of these runs to have been done by someone else for the rest ring system to work properly?

Here's the main flaw in your logic. This isn't required for the system to work 'properly'.
Funky