Post by schlix on Nov 29, 2007 21:02:30 GMT
Well, here is my take on the pure rogue, I am posting it mainly to receive some feedback, especially on the questions at the bottom…but any comments are welcome. Its not too different from other rogue builds posted here, but the subrace does lend some benefits - I used Undying for its stat & feat bonuses, and because its the best subrace I currently have (over atomie). I chose sling to generate more sneaks during combat, while changing to a finessable melee weapon for tanking. Plenty of skill points as well, with 18 INT & subrace bonuses.
The goal is to create a rogue that can accomplish all the standard rogue duties, and also be useful in combat (my strategies are described below). Especially in Hells.
The Stalwart Elven Slinging Rogue - 40 Rogue
"Undying" (secret Beyond UltraRare) - requires Elf
- STR +2, DEX +2, CON +4, INT +2, WIS +2, CHA +2, free feat: Dodge, free feat: Luck of Heroes, free feat: Great Fortitude, free feat: Iron Will, free feat: Lightning Reflexes
- Undying receive +3 skill points per legendary level.
Str 8 (10)
Dex 18 (20) [46]
Con 14 (18)
Wis 8 (10)
Int 16 (18)
Cha 8 (10)
1 Bullheaded
2
3 Shield Proficiency
4 +1DEX
5
6 Expertise
7
8 +1DEX
9 Weapon Focus (Sling)
10 Improved Evasion
11
12 +1DEX, Weapon Finesse (or Imp Crit: Sling)
13 Defensive Roll
14
15 Toughness
16 +1DEX, Slippery Mind
17
18 SF: Disable Trap
19 Crippling Strike
20 +1DEX
21 Epic Weapon Focus (Sling)
22
23
24 +1DEX, Gr Dex 1, Epic Dodge
25
26
27 Gr Dex 2
28 +1DEX, ESF: Search
29
30 Armor Skin
31
32 +1DEX, Skill Mastery
33 SC1
34
35
36 +1DEX, SC2, Opportunist
37
38
39 ESF: Discipline
40 +1DEX, SC3
41
42 +1DEX, Legendary Luck
43
44 +1DEX
45 [+1DEX] Legendary Will
46 +1DEX
47
48 +1DEX, Legendary Fort
49
50 +1DEX [+1DEX]
51 Legendary Weapon Focus (Sling)
52 +1DEX
53
54 +1DEX, LSA Discipline
55 [+1DEX]
56 +1DEX
57 SC4
58 +1DEX
59
60 +1DEX [+1DEX], SC5
- feats in italics are class feats
Saves @40(naked; Fort/Ref/Will) 26/34/18
Saves @60(max) 64/77/60
Hit Points (@60) 1,020
AB (@60)
15(pre-epic)+10(epic)+5(feats)+12(LL)+ 18(Base Dex)+6(Max Dex)+3(Craft Wpn)+5(Opportunist)+20(Magic) = 94 (max)
AC (@60)
10(base) +3(studded)+16(armor)+19(Max Dex)+16(nat)+20(Dodge&Haste)+12(Tum)+16(defl)+16(shield)+2(Armor Skin)+3(Craft Armor)+1(Dodge) = 134 (139 w/ Expertise; 144 effective w/ Epic Dodge)
Skill Points (@60)
44(lvl1)+708+80(LL bonus)+60(subrace bonus) = 892
Skills to max (can max 14 skills w/ 10 pts left over; ones in bold are primary, all others are options):
bluff/ craft armor/ craft weapon/ disable trap/ discipline / hide/ listen/ lore/ open lock/ parry/ pick pocket/ search/ set trap/ tumble/ umd
Build Notes
- chose Bullheaded over Strong Soul for discipline boost
- primary weapon is sling
- Weapon Finesse taken for secondary (melee) weapon
- dump all skill points into discipline @ lvl54
- no Epic Prowess (effectively lose 2AB)
- maxed bluff (119 @ lvl60) would assist in effectively boosting AC
Questions
1. After reading the description, it seems Opportunist adds +5 ab (max)? If so, then add +1 to my max AB calc…
2. I am considering omitting Shield Proficiency in place of an item granting this feat. With such an item, does the shield remain equipped even after the item is removed?
3. Weapon finesse is taken so I can switch to a melee weapon for tanking. It seems tanking with a sling wouldn’t be a good idea, with the penalties & AoO’s (tho ive never used a sling as a primary weapon). Point Blank Shot would alleviate this somewhat. Furthermore, I like the versatility of using a slashing (ex.: handaxe) or piercing (ex.: shortsword) weapon, albeit at –5AB. Comments please?
4. An option would be to take Strong Soul, drop Legendary Luck, & take Legendary Hardened Soul + one feat (since LSA Discipline is lost also; feat would probably be either Armor Skin or Epic Prowess). Saves would become 67/74/63. The question is, whats more important, 22 discipline or the save adjustments & AC/AB boost?
The goal is to create a rogue that can accomplish all the standard rogue duties, and also be useful in combat (my strategies are described below). Especially in Hells.
The Stalwart Elven Slinging Rogue - 40 Rogue
"Undying" (secret Beyond UltraRare) - requires Elf
- STR +2, DEX +2, CON +4, INT +2, WIS +2, CHA +2, free feat: Dodge, free feat: Luck of Heroes, free feat: Great Fortitude, free feat: Iron Will, free feat: Lightning Reflexes
- Undying receive +3 skill points per legendary level.
Str 8 (10)
Dex 18 (20) [46]
Con 14 (18)
Wis 8 (10)
Int 16 (18)
Cha 8 (10)
1 Bullheaded
2
3 Shield Proficiency
4 +1DEX
5
6 Expertise
7
8 +1DEX
9 Weapon Focus (Sling)
10 Improved Evasion
11
12 +1DEX, Weapon Finesse (or Imp Crit: Sling)
13 Defensive Roll
14
15 Toughness
16 +1DEX, Slippery Mind
17
18 SF: Disable Trap
19 Crippling Strike
20 +1DEX
21 Epic Weapon Focus (Sling)
22
23
24 +1DEX, Gr Dex 1, Epic Dodge
25
26
27 Gr Dex 2
28 +1DEX, ESF: Search
29
30 Armor Skin
31
32 +1DEX, Skill Mastery
33 SC1
34
35
36 +1DEX, SC2, Opportunist
37
38
39 ESF: Discipline
40 +1DEX, SC3
41
42 +1DEX, Legendary Luck
43
44 +1DEX
45 [+1DEX] Legendary Will
46 +1DEX
47
48 +1DEX, Legendary Fort
49
50 +1DEX [+1DEX]
51 Legendary Weapon Focus (Sling)
52 +1DEX
53
54 +1DEX, LSA Discipline
55 [+1DEX]
56 +1DEX
57 SC4
58 +1DEX
59
60 +1DEX [+1DEX], SC5
- feats in italics are class feats
Saves @40(naked; Fort/Ref/Will) 26/34/18
Saves @60(max) 64/77/60
Hit Points (@60) 1,020
AB (@60)
15(pre-epic)+10(epic)+5(feats)+12(LL)+ 18(Base Dex)+6(Max Dex)+3(Craft Wpn)+5(Opportunist)+20(Magic) = 94 (max)
AC (@60)
10(base) +3(studded)+16(armor)+19(Max Dex)+16(nat)+20(Dodge&Haste)+12(Tum)+16(defl)+16(shield)+2(Armor Skin)+3(Craft Armor)+1(Dodge) = 134 (139 w/ Expertise; 144 effective w/ Epic Dodge)
Skill Points (@60)
44(lvl1)+708+80(LL bonus)+60(subrace bonus) = 892
Skills to max (can max 14 skills w/ 10 pts left over; ones in bold are primary, all others are options):
bluff/ craft armor/ craft weapon/ disable trap/ discipline / hide/ listen/ lore/ open lock/ parry/ pick pocket/ search/ set trap/ tumble/ umd
Build Notes
- chose Bullheaded over Strong Soul for discipline boost
- primary weapon is sling
- Weapon Finesse taken for secondary (melee) weapon
- dump all skill points into discipline @ lvl54
- no Epic Prowess (effectively lose 2AB)
- maxed bluff (119 @ lvl60) would assist in effectively boosting AC
Questions
1. After reading the description, it seems Opportunist adds +5 ab (max)? If so, then add +1 to my max AB calc…
2. I am considering omitting Shield Proficiency in place of an item granting this feat. With such an item, does the shield remain equipped even after the item is removed?
3. Weapon finesse is taken so I can switch to a melee weapon for tanking. It seems tanking with a sling wouldn’t be a good idea, with the penalties & AoO’s (tho ive never used a sling as a primary weapon). Point Blank Shot would alleviate this somewhat. Furthermore, I like the versatility of using a slashing (ex.: handaxe) or piercing (ex.: shortsword) weapon, albeit at –5AB. Comments please?
4. An option would be to take Strong Soul, drop Legendary Luck, & take Legendary Hardened Soul + one feat (since LSA Discipline is lost also; feat would probably be either Armor Skin or Epic Prowess). Saves would become 67/74/63. The question is, whats more important, 22 discipline or the save adjustments & AC/AB boost?