Post by felicity on Apr 14, 2008 17:29:14 GMT
[20/4/08 edit: On closer reading, I find that L pen does not require pre epic pen feats, but epic feat only. So if you read a epic pen book instead it will spare two more feats! So here is the new version, it has 1 more spell pen and another spare feat, but 2 less fort (good trade imo). By going wiz 39/pal 1, pal lvl must delay until level 40 in order to max discipline. Because of this we cannot take pal pre epic for a +2 fort save gain. The final fort save is -2 which sit at 58, still respectable. The extra spare feat can be epic spells, mage armor or epic ruins are good, or maxmize if you want more flexability on spell slots.]
Hi I've been here for a couple weeks, reading the boards and see that wizard are recommended for new players, so I hear from people suggestions on spell choices and made one to suit my playing style. IMO the advantage of wiz over sorc are (1) obviously, more options on spell choices (2) abundant of skill points. (2) can be easily overlooked as I found that in HG you need to be extremely good at the skill to be even useful, wiz can max open lock skill but without dex modifier and rogue bonus, her open lock skill is basically useless in level appropriate area. So that leaves us with (1). To match the combat versatility of sorc, wiz need the strategical edge - options on spell choices, a good wiz must be able to perform tactics that a sorc simply cannot copy. However without LL focus, your spells will not beat the mobs saves - means that your spells will do nothing. So there IMO wiz need to have at least 5 schools or else you would better just play a sorc, because a well built sorc has no problem covering 3 schools, or even 4 with a good sub, though surely some more knowledgable people than me may disagree.
The purpose of this build is to grab five schools with LL foci, decent saves and respectable DC. Although I said this is a newbie build, it requires illithid sub, open sub simply will not do.
The result of this build is 5 LL foci, good enough saves (for a wiz), and ok DC (62 INT). The five foci, basing on suggestions around the board that I chose for my char are: evo(mandatory for bigbys), necro(nice instant kill), illusion(Instant kill and 5% buff to EV), Trans(Wall, and 55 dc FtS), enchant(+14 gmw, mindfog and maze). Another good choice is conjuration if you think enchantment is duplicated by bard. The level 8 spell greater planar binding can paralyse outsider with their will saves -5, effectively it's a +5 dc to your spell (DC 57 with 62 INT ), and the best thing is this spell bypasses SR means it may disable some mobs that usually are untouchable by other casters. Evard tentacles does great damage to anything without blunt immunity and resistence, mind the kick back though. I am not seeing anything good in Divination school except the epic, some people may find max c/c useful but I'm not sure. Anyway you're free to experiment and modify which spell school you like, I think with a genie you can even put in 6 foci.
Pros:
- 5 LL foci
- Decent saves (reflex 58, will 62, fort 58)
Cons:
- No evasion
- 1 DC lower than max dc thid wiz
- No maximaze spell (I find it redundant, it's best for sorc imo)
Now the details:
Race: Gnome
Subrace: Illithid (innate slippery mind, iron will)
STR 6 (5) -1
CON 17 (16) -1
INT 18 (23) +5
CHA 14
(rest unchanged)
Book : Penetration
All points into INT of course.
Pre Epic Level Progression:
All Wiz
Pre Epic Feats:
1. SF: Ench
2. Gr. SF: Ench
3. SF: Evo
4. Gr. SF: Evo
5. SF: Necro
6. Gr. SF: Necro
7. Gr. SF: Illusion
Wiz Pre Epic Bonus Feats:
1. Extend Spell
2. Empower Spell
3. SF: Trans
Epic Level Progression:
21-39 Wiz
40 Pal
Epic Feats:
1. E. SF: Ench
2. E. SF: Evocation
3. E. SF: Necro
4. E. SF: Illusion
5. Gr. SF: Trans
6. E. SF: Trans
7. (Your Choice)
Epic Wizard Bonus Feats:
1. INT 1
2. INT 2
3. INT 3
4. INT 4
5. INT 5
6. INT 6
7. INT 7
(You may want to take all the INT feat sooner for skill points bonus, I did this but in retrospect it was not needed as skill points are plenty enough)
Legendary Level Feats:
1. LL Pen
2. LL Necro
3. LL Evo
4. LL Illusion
5. LL Enchant
6. LL Trans
7. Epic Reflex
Stats at level 60:
CON = 28 (base 16 + items 12)
DEX = 20 (base 8 + items 12)
WIS = 20 (base 8 + items 12)
INT = 62 (base 23 + items 12 + feats 7 + leveling 20)
CHA = 26 (base 14 + items 12)
Saves:
Will = 61 with slippery mind (Base 21 + LL 5 + Magic 20 + Wis 5 + Cha 8 + Iron will 2)
Reflex = 58 (Base 16 + LL 5 + magic 20 + Dex 5 + Cha 8 + Epic Reflex 4)
Fort = 60 (Base 18 + LL 5 + magic 20 + Con 9 + Cha 8)
Skills:
Max everything except:
Craft weapon
Move silently
Hide
Persuade
Set Trap
Intimidate
Hi I've been here for a couple weeks, reading the boards and see that wizard are recommended for new players, so I hear from people suggestions on spell choices and made one to suit my playing style. IMO the advantage of wiz over sorc are (1) obviously, more options on spell choices (2) abundant of skill points. (2) can be easily overlooked as I found that in HG you need to be extremely good at the skill to be even useful, wiz can max open lock skill but without dex modifier and rogue bonus, her open lock skill is basically useless in level appropriate area. So that leaves us with (1). To match the combat versatility of sorc, wiz need the strategical edge - options on spell choices, a good wiz must be able to perform tactics that a sorc simply cannot copy. However without LL focus, your spells will not beat the mobs saves - means that your spells will do nothing. So there IMO wiz need to have at least 5 schools or else you would better just play a sorc, because a well built sorc has no problem covering 3 schools, or even 4 with a good sub, though surely some more knowledgable people than me may disagree.
The purpose of this build is to grab five schools with LL foci, decent saves and respectable DC. Although I said this is a newbie build, it requires illithid sub, open sub simply will not do.
The result of this build is 5 LL foci, good enough saves (for a wiz), and ok DC (62 INT). The five foci, basing on suggestions around the board that I chose for my char are: evo(mandatory for bigbys), necro(nice instant kill), illusion(Instant kill and 5% buff to EV), Trans(Wall, and 55 dc FtS), enchant(+14 gmw, mindfog and maze). Another good choice is conjuration if you think enchantment is duplicated by bard. The level 8 spell greater planar binding can paralyse outsider with their will saves -5, effectively it's a +5 dc to your spell (DC 57 with 62 INT ), and the best thing is this spell bypasses SR means it may disable some mobs that usually are untouchable by other casters. Evard tentacles does great damage to anything without blunt immunity and resistence, mind the kick back though. I am not seeing anything good in Divination school except the epic, some people may find max c/c useful but I'm not sure. Anyway you're free to experiment and modify which spell school you like, I think with a genie you can even put in 6 foci.
Pros:
- 5 LL foci
- Decent saves (reflex 58, will 62, fort 58)
Cons:
- No evasion
- 1 DC lower than max dc thid wiz
- No maximaze spell (I find it redundant, it's best for sorc imo)
Now the details:
Race: Gnome
Subrace: Illithid (innate slippery mind, iron will)
STR 6 (5) -1
CON 17 (16) -1
INT 18 (23) +5
CHA 14
(rest unchanged)
Book : Penetration
All points into INT of course.
Pre Epic Level Progression:
All Wiz
Pre Epic Feats:
1. SF: Ench
2. Gr. SF: Ench
3. SF: Evo
4. Gr. SF: Evo
5. SF: Necro
6. Gr. SF: Necro
7. Gr. SF: Illusion
Wiz Pre Epic Bonus Feats:
1. Extend Spell
2. Empower Spell
3. SF: Trans
Epic Level Progression:
21-39 Wiz
40 Pal
Epic Feats:
1. E. SF: Ench
2. E. SF: Evocation
3. E. SF: Necro
4. E. SF: Illusion
5. Gr. SF: Trans
6. E. SF: Trans
7. (Your Choice)
Epic Wizard Bonus Feats:
1. INT 1
2. INT 2
3. INT 3
4. INT 4
5. INT 5
6. INT 6
7. INT 7
(You may want to take all the INT feat sooner for skill points bonus, I did this but in retrospect it was not needed as skill points are plenty enough)
Legendary Level Feats:
1. LL Pen
2. LL Necro
3. LL Evo
4. LL Illusion
5. LL Enchant
6. LL Trans
7. Epic Reflex
Stats at level 60:
CON = 28 (base 16 + items 12)
DEX = 20 (base 8 + items 12)
WIS = 20 (base 8 + items 12)
INT = 62 (base 23 + items 12 + feats 7 + leveling 20)
CHA = 26 (base 14 + items 12)
Saves:
Will = 61 with slippery mind (Base 21 + LL 5 + Magic 20 + Wis 5 + Cha 8 + Iron will 2)
Reflex = 58 (Base 16 + LL 5 + magic 20 + Dex 5 + Cha 8 + Epic Reflex 4)
Fort = 60 (Base 18 + LL 5 + magic 20 + Con 9 + Cha 8)
Skills:
Max everything except:
Craft weapon
Move silently
Hide
Persuade
Set Trap
Intimidate