TinyMonk (25 monk/10 fighter/5 harper scout)

[arek]

This build has been superseded by my new Fists of Furry build. While this build does still work, it's far from optimal and simply doesn't fare as well in current content as I think the above-linked build will. Feel free to use this build if you wish, but don't expect any further support for it from me.

Admins, feel free to move this build to either the Base Class/Monk forum or to the Archive.

--Arek


Monks on Higher Ground can deal some of the highest damage of any tank in the game. At the same time, they can also be very sturdy, able to take a real beating as well as dish one out. This monk, based on yomi's Flying Fists, should be able to stand up to some of the toughest monsters on HG, while still being able to place respectably on the damage charts.

Pros:

• High AC (should be able to get into the high 130s easily with buffs, possibly even into the low 140s pre-demi)
  
• High number of attacks - up to 10 attacks per round with the HS boots and Flurry active.
  
• Decent AB - 94 max, 88 median without Flurry, 92 max, 86 median with.
  
• Good Saves (lowest is 63 - which is enough for anywhere in the mod, even the deep Hells)
  
• Improved Evasion (means no more than half damage from most damaging aoes)
  
• Decent SR
  
• 50% Innate Conceal

Cons:

• Requires HG Enhanced (available here) in order to take Greater Weapon Focus at Level 9.
  
• Dexterity-based means a lower damage output overall, vs. a Str-based monk.
  
• Small Size also means that your fists do less base damage overall than a medium or large toon. I don't consider this to be a problem for a DEX monk, but if you do, see Subrace Options below.
  
• Cannot stand up to strength checks without help (only relevant in the Hells and some of the very hardest LL areas, afaik).
  
• DEX-based AC without any levels of Rogue/DD means that if you get caught flat-footed, you're probably dead. Learn to avoid this at all costs (the BUR helm "Visor of Vigilance" would be extremely nice on this build - but be warned: It's probably the most sought-after helm in the game).

And now the build.
=====================================================

Race: Gnome

Gnomes get +2 CON for -2 STR. This is acceptable, since the toon is DEX-based and deoesn't really need the STR. Unfortunately, the CON bonus gets negated by the subrace we choose. Gnomes are also small-sized characters, meaning that they get a subtle +1 AC and AB, but at the expense of (for an unarmed monk) some damage.

Subrace: Svirfneblin

This must be entered exactly as shown, and is case-sensitive (svirfneblin won't work, it has to be Svirfneblin).
Svirfneblin grants +2 Dexterity and +2 Wisdom, in exchange for -2 Constitution and -2 Charisma. Dexterity and Wisdom are nice, since Dexterity will improve your AC and AB, and Wisdom will improve your AC. The penalties to Constitution and Charisma are bearable, since the Constitution penalty only negetes the Gnome bonus, and Charisma is, for all intents and purposes, useless on a Monk.

(stats listed as to be entered at char creation)
STR: 8
DEX: 16 -> 18
CON: 16 -> 14
WIS: 14 -> 16
INT: 14
CHA: 8 -> 6

Level progression:

1: Monk

• Feat: Strong Soul - This feat grants +1 to fort and will, which is nice.
  
• Skills: Max The following:
  
  • Discipline - Discipline checks are very common in this mod, and many of those can do some very nasty things to you, so this should be as high as you can get it on pretty much any toon.
    
  • Hide - Having a high Hide makes it so that you can get good conceal from Mass Camo (from your friendly ranger or druid). It is also required for the Self Conceal feats later.
    
  • Parry - Parry on this mod reduces the damage you take from Critical Hits by 1% for every 2 points you have over 20. This caps out at 50% with 120 skill, including bardsong and items.
    
  • Tumble - Tumble grants +1 dodge AC for every base rank you have in it, capping at +12 AC with 60 ranks.

2: Monk

• Skills: Max Discipline, Hide, Parry, and Tumble

3: Monk

• Feat: Weapon Finesse - This feat allows you to use your DEX modifier instead of your STR modifier to determine your AB.
  
• Skills: Max Discipline, Hide, Parry, and Tumble

4: Monk

• Stat point: Dexterity - This helps your AB and your AC. Every 2 points of DEX you have will increase these by 1.
  
• Skills: Max Discipline, Hide, Parry, and Tumble

5: Monk

• Skills: Max Discipline, Hide, Parry, and Tumble

6: Monk

• Feat: Toughness - This adds 1 HP per character level, retroactively. At level 60, this will be 60 HP. Not too shabby.
  
• Skills: Max Discipline, Hide, Parry, and Tumble

7: Monk

• Skills: Max Discipline, Hide, Parry, and Tumble

8: Monk

• Stat: Dexterity
  
• Skills: Max Discipline, Hide, Parry, and Tumble

9: Monk

• Feat: Greater Weapon Focus: Unarmed Strike - This feat provides +1 AB, which increases your chance to hit stuff. A better chance of hitting stuff is always welcome on a tank. :-)
  
• Skills: Max Discipline, Hide, Parry, and Tumble

10: Monk

• Skills: Max Discipline, Hide, Parry, and Tumble

11: Fighter - Fighter provides you with 3 extra pre-epic feats, and 3 extra epic feats, including both Weapon Specialization and Epic Weapon Specialization. Extremely nice.

• Feat: Improved Critical: Unarmed Strike - This feat increases your critical hit range on unarmed attacks from 20/x2 to 19-20/x2, which will increase your overall damage output somewhat.
  
• Skills: Max Discipline and Parry

12: Fighter

• Stat: Dexterity
  
• Feats:
  
  • Iron Will - Iron Will gives you +2 to your Will save, and is required for Harper Scout
    
  • Weapon Focus: Unarmed Strike - Weapon Focus: Unarmed Strike grants you +1 to your AB.
• Skills: Max Discipline and Parry

13: Fighter

• Skills: Max Discipline and Parry

14: Fighter

• Feat: Weapon Specialization: Unarmed Strike - This gives you +2 damage to all your attacks.
  
• Skills: Max Discipline and Parry

15: Monk

• Feat: Blind Fight
  
• Skills: Max Discipline, Hide, Parry, and Tumble

16: Monk

• Stat: Dexterity
  
• Skills: Max Discipline, Hide, Parry, and Tumble

17: Monk

• Skills: Max Discipline, Hide, Parry, and Tumble

18: Monk

• Feat: Alertness - This gives you a bonus to your initiative check (nice when you need to chug a heal in a hurry), and is required for Harper Scout.
  
• Skills: Max Discipline, Hide, Parry, and Tumble

19: Monk

• Skills: Max Discipline, Hide, Parry, and Tumble

20: Monk

• Stat: Dexterity
  
• Skills: Max Discipline, Hide, Parry, and Tumble

21: Fighter

• Feat: Great Dexterity 1 - This increases your Dexterity score by 1 point, which in turn increases your AB and AC. You'll take all 10 of these.
  
• Skills: Max Discipline and Parry

22: Fighter

• Feat: Epic Weapon Focus: Unarmed Strike - This adds +2 to your AB. Nice.
  
• Skills: Max Discipline and Parry

23: Fighter

• Skills: Max Discipline and Parry

24: Fighter

• Stat: Dexterity
  
• Feats:
  
  • Great Dexterity 2
    
  • Epic Prowess - Epic Prowess adds +1 to your AB right away. When combined with Legendary Weapon Focus, it adds another +1 to your AB, for a total of +2, which is very nice.
• Skills: Max Discipline and Parry

25: Fighter

• Skills: Max Discipline and Parry

26: Fighter

• Feat: Epic Weapon Specialization: Unarmed Strike - This adds another +4 per attack to your damage - really nice.
  
• Skills: Max Discipline and Parry

27: Monk

• Feat: Great Dexterity 3
  
• Skills: Max Discipline, Hide, Parry, and Tumble, then take the following:
  
  • 6 Lore
    
  • 8 Persuade
    
  • 4 Search
  The points in Lore, Persuade, and Search are required for taking Harper Scout later.

28: Monk

• Stat: Dexterity
  
• Skills: Max Discipline, Hide, Parry, and Tumble

29: Monk

• Skills: Max Discipline, Hide, Parry, and Tumble

30: Monk

• Feat: Great Dexterity 4
  
• Skills: Max Discipline, Hide, Parry, and Tumble

31: Harper Scout

• Feat: Great Dexterity 5
  
• Skills: Max Discipline and Tumble

32: Harper Scout

• Stat: Dexterity
  
• Skills: Max Discipline and Tumble, then put 30 points in Hide - 30 Hide is a prerequisite for Self Concealment, which will give you up to 50% concealment with all 5 Self Concealment feats.

33: Harper Scout

• Feat: Self-Concealment 1 - Concealment makes monsters have to roll 1d100 to hit you before they make their regular attack roll. This build will eventaully get 50% conceal, which means that most monsters will need to roll 51 or better on 1d100 before they even get to try to hit your AC. The Self-Concealment feats are what grant this conceal. For every Self-Concealment feat you take, you get 10% Concealment. This build takes all 5 Self Concealment feats, which really helps keep stuff from hitting it.
  
• Skills: Max Discipline and Tumble

34: Harper Scout

• Skills: Max Discipline and Tumble

35: Harper Scout

• Feat: Great Dexterity 6
  
• Skills: Max Discipline and Tumble

36: Monk

• Stat: Dexterity
  
• Feat: Self-Concealment 2
  
• Skills: Max Discipline, Hide, Parry, and Tumble

37: Monk

• Skills: Max Discipline, Hide, Parry, and Tumble

38: Monk

• Skills: Max Discipline, Hide, Parry, and Tumble

39: Monk

• Feat: Self-Concealment 3
  
• Skills: Max Discipline, Hide, Parry, and Tumble

40: Monk

• Stat: Dexterity
  
• Feat: Self-Concealment 4
  
• Skills: Max Discipline, Hide, Parry, and Tumble

Naked stats at 40: STR 10, DEX 34, CON 14, WIS 16, INT 12, CHA 6.

Legendary Levels:

From this point forward, all levelling will be done using the !level simtools command. Since you have 25 levels of Monk, all further levels will be automatically taken in Monk (your "Control Class"). Below, I am only going to list levels where a feat will be taken. When it asks you what stat point you want, take dexterity. On all other levels, max the following skills:

• Discipline
  
• Parry
  
• Hide
  
• Listen - Listen helps you penetrate monsters' conceal in the same way Blind-Fight does, and can actually do a better job of it, though it doesn't stack with Blind-Fight (63 Listen gives the same conceal reduction as blind-fight, provided you're not Deafened - more gives more reduction, and being deafened halves the amount).
  
• Craft Armor - Every 40 points you get in this grants you +1 AC, maxing out at +3 AC with 120 points (including buffs, bonuses, etc). This means you get +2 with just bard song, and as much as +3 with equipment.
  
• Tumble until Level 57 (60 ranks) - Tumble will have no use for you beyond this point, since you're a dex-based toon, and you don't gain any extra AC after 60 ranks.
  
• At level 60, dump your remaining points into Use Magic Device (considered Cross-Class for harper scouts in LLs). This will, with the help of equipment and/or bard song, allow you to use scrolls, which is very important.

Legendary Feat Progression
Feats:

• 42: Epic Self-Concealment 5
  
• 45: Legendary Weapon Focus: Unarmed Strike - This provides +2 to your AB, plus an additional +1 to your AB from Epic Prowess, for a total of +3.
  
• 48: Legendary Hardened Soul - This provides +5 to your fortitude and will saves, which will be necessary if you want to survive in the hardest areas of the module.
  
• 51: Epic Great Dexterity 7
  
• 54: Epic Great Dexterity 8
  
• 57: Epic Fortitude - This provides yet another +4 to your fortitude save, which is rather important on a tank, helping you to survive many save-or-die checks in the mod.
  
• 60: Armor Skin - This provides +2 AC, which helps keep you from getting hit as much.

All of the following info is based on info in Yomi's Thri-kreen "Flying Fists" build, and has been edited to reflect the changes made in this build (note: this info may not be completely up-to-date).

Naked stats at 60: STR 10, DEX 46, CON 14, WIS 16, INT 12, CHA 6.
AB: 94, 91, 88, 85, 82, 79, 94 (with full +20 bonus, no flurry/HS)
AB: 92, 89, 86, 83, 80, 77, 92, 87, 82, 77 (Flurry, HS boots)
Saves: 66 Fort, 70 Reflex, 63 Will, if my calculations are right.
HP: 910
AC: 133 using UR/Illithid gear and no song to boost Craft Armor, 136 pre-demi using BURs (assuming you can a +18 amulet and an item with +18 deflection ac on it). You also have permanent 50% conceal, and can activate Empty Body for 65% if desired.

Some considerations:

• Getting the Dis gloves is a big help for the extra 10% physical as well as the great damage.
  
• Make sure you get C/C (Clairaudience/Clairvoyance) from a bard, mage, or cleric when possible to maximize your Listen skill. This will help cut through conceal, which is excellent given your good AB and many attacks/round.
  
• Check what damage types are on the gloves you'll be using the most, and try to get damage buffs in those types. Examples: You want Acid, Cold, and Elec on DB Gloves (and Divine if there's a Paladin, and Neg if there's a Shadowdancer in the party). For DIS Gloves, you want Acid, Fire, Sonic, Divine if Pal in pt, and Magic if a Pariah is in the party.
  
• Also, if you're using L35 or DB gloves, check with your mage and see if you can get a better GMW than +12 from them. If so, take it. IoF does NOT work on gloves, so get GMW if it's better than what your gloves carry. Don't ask for keen, it doesn't work on gloves (you can ONLY get this if it comes on the gloves or you're pure).
  
• With your low STR, stay away from STR KD mobs unless you have UUU available. You will fail the checks against Pit Fiends.
  
• I recommend the Torch of the Unwary if you have it and can fit it in. The extra sneak attack damage will help in the Hells.
  
• Since you really can't stand up to Pit Fiends, use a ranged weapon such as the Monk's Mantras. This is quite workable, though will cause your damage output to be lower. If you have a good caster bard and a fast-killing party you can just hit the PFs while making sure you're inside the UUU radius.

If you look at the damage per hit, you might think the toon isn't that impressive, especially if you're used to a high critting tank. The sheer number of hits makes up for it, and loggers will show that this build can beat many other tanks for damage output.

Subrace Options:

• Human/PT - Water Genasi: Start with 8 STR, 14 CON, 16 WIS (other stats remain the same) at character creation, take Luck of Heroes as your Human bonus feat, and don't take Craft Armor in LLs. You'll lose 1 STR dmg, 1 AB, and 4-5 AC over the Svirfneblin version, and you'll gain a 25% Elec. Vulnerability, but you'll do full damage with your fists (which should actually average at least 4 higher than small fists, which can really add up).
  
• Human/Thri-Kreen (secret, but easy to obtain): See the Thri-Kreen version of Yomi's Flying Fists, which this build is based heavily on.

Tips for levelling:

• Level with a group whenever possible. You'll get more experience that way, and you'll have a fun time, too.
  
• Explore. In addition to 2 places you must visit before getting to certain levels in order to get items you'll need in later areas, and another place you'll need to visit after you get to Level 35 (be sure to ask someone in-game about these if you don't know where they are), there are many interesting places around Higher Ground for you to look at, and many monsters who will give you nice items and/or a tag when defeated.

Tips for playing:

• If this is your first toon on Higher Ground, I highly recommend reading The Newbie Guide, as it contains some valuable info.
  
• If you've never played a tank before on HG (regardless of whether or not this is your first toon), I also recommend reading Tanking for those with a low INT score, since it gives some nice tips on how to play a tank.
  
• One thing this tank relies on is having a high number of attacks per round (9-10). In order to get this many attacks, you'll need to find a special set of boots after you get to Level 35. These boots are only wearable by toons with 5 levels of Harper Scout and, when activated, grant an extra 2 attacks per round. Be sure and ask someone in-game where to find them, since the location cannot be disclosed here (it's a secret).

And the most important thing? HAVE FUN

--Arek

[MurphysLawAgain]

Just a thought, but if you take UMD (available to Harper Scout in LL's) instead of appraise you will be able to use scrolls. The build as posted doesn't say how many points are available for this but if its 29+ its well worth doing. Also you refer to Harper Scout boots but don't explain what they are (if not how to get them which is a secret)

[arek]

This build does have 34 extra skill points. However, UMD is considered a cross-class skill for Harper Scouts, meaning you can only get 17 points of UMD with it. While this is enough to use scrolls with +UMD equips and/or bard song, it isn't enough by itself. I do, however, think that the change is probably worth it, so thanks

As for the HS boots, thanks for reminding me about that. I'll put it in.

--Arek

[arek]

No. Epic Prowess gives +1 by itself. The synergy it gives to Legendary Weapon Focus grants another +1, for a total of +2. I mention the bonus in both places in order to make one of the reasons for taking both feats clear.

--Arek

[tyranlthixis]

First of all I'm glad somebody posted a monk build....because I was dreading working one out.

I've seen yomi's and sabre's monk, which is very similar, in action it is a good choice for low level players.

Extra content is decent but the formating needs a little work. I'm also having trouble finding which stats you want to increase on the regular level ups. Also, not a huge fan of the name. I think little things like that hurt you in the contest.

One more issue. A small monk has a reduced damage production, compared to a medium sized monk due to the size of their fists. Is it possible to post a medium sized, alternative at the top?

Tyranlthixis

[StrykerOfChaos]

PT - Water Genasi would probably be a good fit. It gets +2 Dex +2 Con -2 Wis -2Cha. You could swap around the stats to accomodate this. Worst case is you might end up losing a couple AC (not sure, didn't test the stats) but as Tyr pointed out you wouldn't get the damage reduction for being small sized. You'd also get a free feat this way ^_^

[arek]

PT - Water Genasi looks good....until you hit that 25% Electrical Vulnerability. I may make a mention of it in the post, but more likely, if it's allowed, I'll put a note closer to the bottom that if one can get ahold of thri-kreen, it can be used to make a non-small version of this, linking again to Yomi's post.

That said, I think there is one other race that'd make a decent unarmed monk, tho it may wind up being a different build....Lizardfolk. I only wish I'd had time to come up with a build for it in time for the contest.

--Arek

[StrykerOfChaos]

You might be able to get better damage if you use Nunchakus (non-slaggable) or Kamas with small size, instead of with fists.

Just a thought.

[Torin]

For a Dexer Monk, it's not that bad to be small I think:
+1 AB
+1 AC (if you are a dexer that uses shields, being small grants you effectively no AC bonus since you get +1 aC but you can not use Towershields. But for a Character with no shield, you really get +1 AC)
- 2 physical damage (1-16 instead of 1-20 is -2 in the average) But since dexers focus not on physical damage, this is not that important.

[arek]

May 19, 2009 20:00:27 GMT StrykerOfChaos said:

You might be able to get better damage if you use Nunchakus (non-slaggable) or Kamas with small size, instead of with fists.

Just a thought.

No...Kamas only do 1d4 base damage...Nunchaku do 1d6. Fists do 2d6 base damage for a small character. IMO, the only reason to go Nunchaku or Kama as a monk is to dual wield...something this build doesn't do.

I'm with Torin here....for a DEX monk, small size isn't bad, and going Gnome allows me to take Craft Armor. Something a Human can't do.

Thanks for the input, tho.

--Arek

[chrystoph]

It would definitely be good to point out that this is a Dex based AC build, which means that Flatfooted has a huge impact on AC.

[arek]

Good point - done.

--Arek

[arek]

With the latest changes to the mod, a lot of nice items are getting race/alignment restrictions. With that in mind, it might be a good idea to drop Craft Armor (dump points in CA at 60 still, tho) in favor of UMD, and Armor Skin in favor of ESF: UMD (taken closer to 60, move G.Dex feats up to do it). You'd lose 3 AC and get a maximum of 98 UMD (assuming a +14 cha item), which is enough to use many restricted R and UR items, and maybe some BURs as well.

I have not updated the build with this, yet, but would like some thoughts on the matter.

--Arek

[chrystoph]

I can see the value of the argument, but I think I would offer it as an alternative path with an explanation of what you gain and lose by following both paths.

[arek]

Looking over the build to fit in the newest changes: I dropped 2x Great Dex to pick up Greater Weapon Focus and Legendary Hardened Soul. Net result: -1 AC, -1 reflex, +5 fort/will. This makes the lowest save (fort) 62 instead of 57, and should make the toon a viable abyss-level tank after 2xD.

As for the wisdom problem: Leave wisdom as-is. With +12 wis, it will grant a +9 damage bonus on your gloves, going up to +10 with a +14 wis item (available at L60), and as high as +12 at double-demi. I think that's great for an Open Subrace. You *could* get 1 more by dropping 2 dex for 2 wis at creation, but I don't recommend it.

If you really wanted to, you could make this with Nunchaku instead of Unarmed, simply by taking the correct feats. In that case, I'd also recommend dropping 2 STR for 2 INT at creation, so you can take Craft Weapon, which can improve your AB by as much as 3 points in the same way Craft Armor improves AC. Doing this would also allow you to accept damage buffs, but remove your ability to use a megadamage weapon of any damage type as appropriate for the situation.

--Arek