The Hidden Lunatic (Wizard 60)

[chainlink]

You won't get an answer form Cath as he left a long while ago, however I rebuilt an Illithid into a Genie and used something similar to this build recently although I went for illusion as well. You will miss out on a few ac as you won't be able to use the UR ward but I suspect it will be fine. One thing to bear in mind is that the Styx (and its guardians) will not be something you want to come into contact with as your saves are not exactly uber.

[gren]

Thanks for that!

Any response is equally as good as one from the OP.

Yep, saves are bad but would take an awful lot to make em good - a few feats or a level of Pally. Am looking to make this guy all about offence to saves and AC will suffer, relying on EV etc.

If it doesn't work out or is too squishy then I can alway reincarnate and maybe spread some Pally cheese.

[chainlink]

If you want to make an all out offence arcane caster then I'd suggest this build is not the one you want as you're burning feats on non-caster specific stuff however what this one does well is survive and cast as with a 120+ ac and 90% conceal you don't get hit much. As I already have a pure Genie old style caster I thought I'd make one of these to compare and although different it seems quite fun to play.

[gren]

I take it you mean the tumble, discipline and armor skin? This is though still a build thats all about offense - normally those I make are very defensive biased. Its all relative

I also couldn't find any more pure builds, maybe cos they are so starightforward and not worth putting forward.

I've also not been around long enough to be able to compare this to an 'old style caster' not knowing what one looks like!

[chainlink]

Most of the "Old style" casters just focus on spell feats and leave the tumble, discipline as cross class skills or dump into them at 40 by taking a monk, ranger, etc. level. Using this build you're going to miss out on a maxed dc in another school vs. a standard wizzy but if you take the right schools its not a huge problem. If you're reincarnating it might be worth holding off until the next round of changes kick in or you might find your mage sitting on the sidelines for three months but if you're building from scratch its not going to be a problem.

[gren]

Thanks again for the infor Chainlink.

It's a new build so not a problem - my first BUR race ;D

[tempus]

Cath, took div. due to the fact he loved PWK and the proposed changes to Legend lore and Prem. Until those changes arrive, going evo/necro/illousion/trans, is going to benefit your character more, (again atm.) As a wizzy you dont need 5 epics, going 4 and making sure you are standing at the end is what its about. Those 4 schools I listed, atm are the most utilized. The problem with gnome is the fact you cannot use the UR Ward, as was stated earlier...However if you get a hand on the asmo shield you are going to be set.
Getting your hands on a stygian orb and an impulse of the impasse shield are going to be your bread and butter until you do get the asmo shield.


Amicus

[gren]

Thanks again for the help - confirms that most of my assumptions are correct.

Gnome is a problem but not got a choice with the Spelljammer. I'd be able to use a shield with the Sussurus though wouldn't I? It's a fashion accessory so doesn't need 2 hands.

[Delfestra Ruinvorn]

Tempus the sorc puts his oar in the water

Personally, I tend to believe in having as many epics as possible - for a maximum effectiveness out of the spell depth that a wizard enjoys.

I know I've never posted my wizzy build, and I'm not likely to...but I didn't put feats into LL-Affinity enablers, nor did I put them into armor skin or save feats. If you're so close to the front line combat that your AC and saves are a real issue, then you're in trouble anyway.

And I have Leg Spell pen (duh), 4 LSFoci and 1 epic foci (thats 5 epics), also greater ruin. Which is a ton of fun (enough to trade out that 5th LSF at least).

Yes, as a gnome, you can use fashion accessories and shields. Sussurus, Dachy Codex, and Orb of Necessity (Stygia) it is for you.

[gren]

Okay.....I'm getting there, am taking Blooded and LSA:Tumble for the AC but am looking to bring in some more firepower if possible. Am down to 3 options on the feats :

- Leave in armor skin and swap LSA:Disc (not taken Bullheaded) and greater ruin for another 2 x INT

- Drop armor skin, LSA:Disc and greater ruin and get another 3xspell foci and epic (Divination?)

- Drop silent spell, armor skin, LSA:Disc and greater ruin and get all 4xspell foci and epic (divination?)

Anyone got any thoughts as to which is the best option. I'm sure there are other combinations of this as well. I've only just started this build so got plenty of time but like to plan well in advance.

[chainlink]

If you don't have LSA disc (and you can't fit both this and LSA tumble into a Gnome build) you will often find yourself shieldless in certain areas which although annoying for tank types will be a big pita for you as the shields you'll be using are likely to have spell slots on them, obviously once you get access to the Asmo shield this will cease to be an issue
Greater ruin can be a party saver if a 'noobeater' or para 'noobeater' (some other nasties as well) shows up at the wrong time so I'd try and hold on to this if at all possible. I can live without Divination but that's personal choice.

[gren]

Yep, another pain in the *** with having to use Gnome race - only 1 lvl 1 feat. Never used GR much but I guess it could be quite potent on this build. I never thought much of Divination spells so not worried about the DC but the epic is quite cool.

As for the Asmo shield, I've not been past Dis before so that could be a while But you you have got me thinking of getting shield proficiency..............

Maybe just go for the extra 2 points of INT and lose LSA:Disc and either armor skin or silent spell (got extended and HG hak so less need)

[Oberu]

I know I'm coming into this discussion a bit after the fact but I have a few curiosities. I have a negati PM that I love to play and that got me thinking about a wizard made from the same race. If I'm right then you could take one more feat for still III and be able to cast in plate if you liked. There are a few interesting suits of full plate available to wizards to boot like Plate of Anubis which is BUR but allows for an area of effect Finger of Death spell. I tend to go the same route as Delf in her love for a wizards diversity and being capable to throw down in several schools. I think that Negati would be a good race to use to achieve a bit more AC. Tell me what you think : )

[chirikov]

the problem is that the additional ac doesnt really benefit a wizard much. the heavy armors like plate of anubis is targeted towards palemasters, who can put it to much more effective use after stacking their bone skin bonus on top of it. a wiz (who will prolly need to splash to get all the necessary feats) is going to be at a disadvantage in both ac and concealment

the loss of starting spell school feats and the additional feat to hit autostill 3 means you lose out on an epic as well, which seems contrary to your goal of maximizing diversity

[uncanny]

Have been considering reqorking my own wizard into this build.. but I'm wondering just how playable it is pre-60 (or should I say, without the luxury of BURs).