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Post by exidorthequick on Jan 24, 2007 13:08:29 GMT
I've merged bhao's Monk Elementalist concept with what I was working on to produce this quasiclass idea: Disciple of Acid/Cold/Electricity/Fire/Sound (Druid/Monk)Those monks who follow the path of nature are often drawn to meditate on the purity of a single aspect of the natural world. They attune themselves, mind and body, to this aspect of nature, and from this focus draw strength. This bond becomes a conduit through which the Disciple can unleash tremendous power. Requirements:• Must have 10 levels of Druid, 10 Levels of Monk, Skill Focus: Concentration, one of the Energy Resistance feats and the corresponding Epic Energy Resistance I feat by level 21. Upon meeting the quasiclass requirements, the Disciple becomes focused in whichever element they have taken Epic Energy Resistance against. 1Benefits:• Upon meeting the quasiclass requirements, the Disciple receives an item that indicates the Disciple's elemental focus. A Disciple of Acid, for example, would receive an item called Way of Acid. Energy Resistance or Epic Energy Resistance feats taken in other elements later do not change the Disciple's focus element. This item is used to control the Disciple's imbue weapon ability (see next bullet). • The Disciple may imbue his or her melee weapon(s) 2 with elemental damage. Imbued weapons become linked to the Disciple and may not be dropped (as with an Assassin's hone weapon ability). An imbued weapon inflicts bonus damage equal to (Monk Level/2) + (# of EER feats in focus element)d4, to a maximum of 25 + 10d4. Duration is 1 round per Druid level, or 50 rounds maximum. This ability may be used an unlimited number of times per day. 3• Stunning Fist attacks do elemental damage in addition to their normal effect. 4 If the attack hits and the target fails its save, the damage done is (Monk Level/2) + (# of EER feats in focus element)d6, to a maximum of 25 + 10d6. If the target saves against the stun effect the amount of elemental damage inflicted is halved. For Disciples with Monk as their control class, this elemental damage applies to the Disciple's "Stunning Whirl" if they have the Whirlwind or Improved Whirlwind feats. • Quivering Palm does elemental damage in addition to its normal effect. 5 If the attack hits it inflicts an additional (Monk Level + Druid Level) x ((# of EER feats in focus element) + 5) damage, to a maximum of 900 damage. This damage is inflicted even if the target saves against death, or is immune to the death effect of Quivering Palm. • For all Druid spells, Caster Level and Spell Penetration are equal to Druid Level + (Monk Level/3). • All Druid spells which do elemental damage should have the type of damage they do changed to match the Disciple's focus element, and should do extra damage of that type based on the number of Epic Energy Reduction feats that the Disciple has taken for that element. 6• Upon reaching level 41, if the Disciple's control class is either Druid or Monk, the Disciple is granted 5% elemental immunity to their focus element per legendary level, to a maximum of 100% immunity at level 60. Notes:• If the Disciple's control class is Druid, then legendary levels are counted as Druid levels for all calculations. If the Disciple's control class is Monk, then legendary levels are counted as Monk levels for all calculations. 1 If, at level 21, a would-be Disciple has not taken the Energy Resistance feat corresponding to the element in which the Disciple took Epic Energy Resistance I, they will not qualify for the quasiclass. (It is okay if the Disciple has multiple Energy Resistance feats, as long as they have also taken Epic Energy Resistance I in an element corresponding to one of those elements for which they have Energy Resistance.) 2 Ideally, this should be able to be used to imbue either the Disciple's melee attacks or unarmed attacks with elemental damage. If I understand correctly, however, this is at best impractical to implement, so I've written the power to be limited to melee weapons. If it can be arranged to work for unarmed attacks, then so much the better. 3 The Disciple can keep this ability active almost continuously, but the less Druid levels the Disciple has the more often he or she will have to stop and renew it. 4 I've retained the stunning effect of Stunning Fist because I don't see any reason to take away this potentially useful ability. Compared to a pure Monk of equal level, the Disciple's Stunning Fist will do more damage but the Disciple will not have as many uses of it per day. Also, the extra damage done by the Disciple's Stunning Fist has been paid for with the purchase of one or more Epic Energy Resistance feats. 5 I've retained the death effect of Quivering Palm because this ability isn't very impressive to begin with. It's only one use per day, and there are many foes who are simply immune to its effect. Compared to a pure Monk of equal level, the Disciple's Quivering Palm is useful against a broader range of foes, however the Disciple has paid for this additional usefulness by purchasing one or more Epic Energy Resistance feats. 6 This benefit isn't vital to the quasiclass concept, so if it needs to be scratched for being too labor-intensive then the quasiclass can survive without it. However, this aspect of the quasiclass would be a nice way to draw everything together conceptually, so I hope it's not too hard to implement.
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Post by flynn01 on Jan 24, 2007 19:06:33 GMT
Re: Drunken monk.
If possible, it'd be neat to see a bonus granted from drinking the various ales and spirits in the game.
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Post by resonance378 on Jan 24, 2007 21:25:31 GMT
Reminds me of the old Kung Fu classic: The 5 Deadly Venoms! I like it, would be neat if possible. I've merged bhao's Monk Elementalist concept with what I was working on to produce this quasiclass idea: Disciple of Acid/Cold/Electricity/Fire/Sound (Druid/Monk)Those monks who follow the path of nature are often drawn to meditate on the purity of a single aspect of the natural world. They attune themselves, mind and body, to this aspect of nature, and from this focus draw strength. This bond becomes a conduit through which the Disciple can unleash tremendous power. Requirements:• Must have 10 levels of Druid, 10 Levels of Monk, Skill Focus: Concentration, one of the Energy Resistance feats and the corresponding Epic Energy Resistance I feat by level 21. Upon meeting the quasiclass requirements, the Disciple becomes focused in whichever element they have taken Epic Energy Resistance against. 1Benefits:• Upon meeting the quasiclass requirements, the Disciple receives an item that indicates the Disciple's elemental focus. A Disciple of Acid, for example, would receive an item called Way of Acid. Energy Resistance or Epic Energy Resistance feats taken in other elements later do not change the Disciple's focus element. This item is used to control the Disciple's imbue weapon ability (see next bullet). • The Disciple may imbue his or her melee weapon(s) 2 with elemental damage. Imbued weapons become linked to the Disciple and may not be dropped (as with an Assassin's hone weapon ability). An imbued weapon inflicts bonus damage equal to (Monk Level/2) + (# of EER feats in focus element)d4, to a maximum of 25 + 10d4. Duration is 1 round per Druid level, or 50 rounds maximum. This ability may be used an unlimited number of times per day. 3• Stunning Fist attacks do elemental damage in addition to their normal effect. 4 If the attack hits and the target fails its save, the damage done is (Monk Level/2) + (# of EER feats in focus element)d6, to a maximum of 25 + 10d6. If the target saves against the stun effect the amount of elemental damage inflicted is halved. For Disciples with Monk as their control class, this elemental damage applies to the Disciple's "Stunning Whirl" if they have the Whirlwind or Improved Whirlwind feats. • Quivering Palm does elemental damage in addition to its normal effect. 5 If the attack hits it inflicts an additional (Monk Level + Druid Level) x ((# of EER feats in focus element) + 5) damage, to a maximum of 900 damage. This damage is inflicted even if the target saves against death, or is immune to the death effect of Quivering Palm. • For all Druid spells, Caster Level and Spell Penetration are equal to Druid Level + (Monk Level/3). • All Druid spells which do elemental damage should have the type of damage they do changed to match the Disciple's focus element, and should do extra damage of that type based on the number of Epic Energy Reduction feats that the Disciple has taken for that element. 6• Upon reaching level 41, if the Disciple's control class is either Druid or Monk, the Disciple is granted 5% elemental immunity to their focus element per legendary level, to a maximum of 100% immunity at level 60. Notes:• If the Disciple's control class is Druid, then legendary levels are counted as Druid levels for all calculations. If the Disciple's control class is Monk, then legendary levels are counted as Monk levels for all calculations. 1 If, at level 21, a would-be Disciple has not taken the Energy Resistance feat corresponding to the element in which the Disciple took Epic Energy Resistance I, they will not qualify for the quasiclass. (It is okay if the Disciple has multiple Energy Resistance feats, as long as they have also taken Epic Energy Resistance I in an element corresponding to one of those elements for which they have Energy Resistance.) 2 Ideally, this should be able to be used to imbue either the Disciple's melee attacks or unarmed attacks with elemental damage. If I understand correctly, however, this is at best impractical to implement, so I've written the power to be limited to melee weapons. If it can be arranged to work for unarmed attacks, then so much the better. 3 The Disciple can keep this ability active almost continuously, but the less Druid levels the Disciple has the more often he or she will have to stop and renew it. 4 I've retained the stunning effect of Stunning Fist because I don't see any reason to take away this potentially useful ability. Compared to a pure Monk of equal level, the Disciple's Stunning Fist will do more damage but the Disciple will not have as many uses of it per day. Also, the extra damage done by the Disciple's Stunning Fist has been paid for with the purchase of one or more Epic Energy Resistance feats. 5 I've retained the death effect of Quivering Palm because this ability isn't very impressive to begin with. It's only one use per day, and there are many foes who are simply immune to its effect. Compared to a pure Monk of equal level, the Disciple's Quivering Palm is useful against a broader range of foes, however the Disciple has paid for this additional usefulness by purchasing one or more Epic Energy Resistance feats. 6 This benefit isn't vital to the quasiclass concept, so if it needs to be scratched for being too labor-intensive then the quasiclass can survive without it. However, this aspect of the quasiclass would be a nice way to draw everything together conceptually, so I hope it's not too hard to implement. Must be a fascination with monks: Re: Drunken monk. If possible, it'd be neat to see a bonus granted from drinking the various ales and spirits in the game. Both the Drunken Monk and the idea of drink being a buff, sounds cool/fun. Difficulty in executing... EDIT: The damage abilities on the monk, being what they are or can be... hit once miss 11 times... plus specializing the damage type. Is the idea to restrict the monk to only one damage type or are you trying to give the monk an element or 'venom' that they can do far more damage than normal in? Drunken monk: the Potions not difficult to execute (duh we have buff potions) just the whole idea of the drunken monk in general.
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Post by starlandra on Jan 25, 2007 5:09:28 GMT
the drunken monk (and just to be snippy and it drunken master ) looks hard to do? 20 monk 15 cleric seems easy to me would love to hear funkys thoughts on these
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Post by DragonChyld on Jan 25, 2007 6:35:43 GMT
Quasi-Class: Demon Consort -REWORKED-
Reworked this, Took some suggestions from this thread, Thanks guys!! Edits from original are in Red
------------------------------------------------------ REQUIREMENTS 12 levels of specialist Wizard (Enchantment) 10 Levels of Barbarian both by 24 Charisma of 16 Gender Specific (Female) Alignment: Any Evil
~FEATS~ Greater Spell Focus Enchantment
~Sample Class Background~ Born to a Barbarian tribe you have always used your charms to get what you want out of life. It was no suprise to you when you were picked at a young age to learn to commune with the Spirit Elders. You were both Fascinated and bored... You wanted something more. When your Barbarian Tribe encounted a Lone Wizard on the road and overtook him they broke his hands... But not his spirit. Intrigued you learned how to read and all you could from him before he died.. Then you set out on a deeper journey..
Becoming a Demon Consort means exactly that, you have used you knowledge, charm and toughness to summon and consort with a Balor. You are granted several special abilitys upon doing this.
Upon becoming a Consort: -Spell DCs for all spells are equal to 10 + spell level + (CON modifier) -For all spells, casterlevels and Spell penetration are equal to Wizard level + (Barbarian level/3) -You receive a Permanent -4 CON, -2 STR, and -2 DEX -Gains the Hellstone item.
~ The Hellstone ~ A Demon Consort may cast any summon creature spell of level 4 or higher into her Hellstone. This will trigger the Hellstone's power and open a gate to hell which a demon, responding to the consorts call, will come through, and aid the Consort for a Number of rounds Equal to the Consort's CHA modifier +1 round per 2 levelsx2 AFTER Becoming a Consort, to a maximum of (CHA mod + 19)x2.
~ Summon Creature IV Summons a Real Shadow Demon to serve the caster
~ Summon Creature V Summons a Real Vrock to serve the caster
~ Summon Creature VI Summons a Real Hezrou to serve the caster
~ Summon Creature VII Summons a Real Nabassu to serve the caster
~ Summon Creature VIII Summons a Real Babau to serve the caster
~ Summon Creature IX Summons a Real Glabrezu to serve the caster
~ Special ~ The Epic Spell Ensnare True Denizen Works Differently for Consorts. The Duration of the spell uses the same formula as above.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Balance Rationale Changing the Spell Ability to con may at first seem overpowered, However as you Become a Consort you take a permanent -4 to CON. Your offensive spellcasting capabilitys become weakened. Your other physical attributes will become affected as well. I switched the Spell DC's from 9/10 con mod, to straight con to take into effect the fact that the con loss is now perm, Also based the durations of the summons off of CHA as per Borts suggestion, thus forcing the Consort to make some tough Decisions. Your goal is to simply stay alive while your Servant provides the power your party is missing from you.
~ DC
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Post by exidorthequick on Jan 25, 2007 11:46:31 GMT
Looks good to me. Can't wait to try one.
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Post by resonance378 on Jan 26, 2007 18:20:03 GMT
DC - Do you have a base build example to run through the CBC to check how bad/crazy it gets overall? I know the CBC doesn't do it all but at least its a way to visually check feasibility overall.
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Post by resonance378 on Jan 26, 2007 18:59:06 GMT
ReWorked Quasi-Class: Singing Saint These masters of Song have honed their craft such that they sing while cutting down their foe in battle. Their songs inspire their friends as they rally around the Singing Saint. The Singing Saint will often bestow curses and call out taunts to their foes, enraging them such that they will forgo years of training in order to attack the Saint thus making costly mistakes in their own defense. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Must Have: 10 levels of Paladin before Level 20 Must Have: 30 levels of Bard by Level 40 Must Have: Feat: Artist (This forces the starting class to Bard) Must Have: Extra Music, Lingering Song, Curse Song, and Lasting Inspiration by 40 Must Have: Base Dexterity of 8.
Must Have: Perform: Ranks: 28+ Must Have: Taunt: Ranks: 28+ Must Have: Use Magic Device: Ranks: 28+ Must Have: Discipline: Ranks: 28+ Must Have: Tumble: Ranks: 28+
--------------------------------------------------------------------------- Must Have: Feat: Weapon Focus: Scimitar
May Not Have: Feat: Weapon Finesse --------------------------------------------------------------------------
At 40: Spell Failure while wearing Heavy Armor with Shield is 5% At 40: Taunt Skill: -6AC@40, -7AC@45, -8AC@50, -9AC@55, -10AC@60 At 40: Taunt Skill: Ranks: Gain +10 At 40: STR, CON, CHA gain +1 per 10/LL ( +2 STR, CON, CHA ) -------------------------------------------------------------------------- At 60: +2 is added to base STR At 60: +2 is added to base CON At 60: +2 is added to base WIS At 60: +2 is added to base CHA -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Things Making it Easy to Script I Hope
LVL1 Bard: Armor Proficiency Light, Armor Proficiency Medium, Shield, Weapon Proficiency Simple, Bard Song, Bardic Knowledge, Shields: Small
LVL1 Paladin: Armor Proficiency Heavy, Weapon Proficiency Martial, Divine Grace, Divine Health, Lay on Hands, Shields: All
Bonuses of Bard Class to play with Paladin are: Tumble, UMD, Taunt, HG Bard Spells
Bonuses of Paladin Class to play with Bard are: WP Martial, Taunt, Paladin Spells,
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ideas not necessary to success of the class:
The Song That Never Ends AoE similar to existing SPELL: Invisibility Sphere WHERE party members within range NNm automatically receive: Bard Song Duration Permanent Until Death Upon Resurrection The Song That Never Ends starts again Auto Cast Idea is that this is a party affecting buff w/in NNm as long as members are within distance NN is starting base 5m at 40 and +5m every 5LL ( or make available through an item pick with 2 use/day) Removed: Adding this would eliminate the need to cast bard song... which would be pointless because of the HG bard modifications. This would needlessly complicate things.
Paladin Change: Remove Disease: Cry of the Devout - as mentioned Here ( Of course, if at all possible )
Please make suggestions and I will update because I know this is a very rough idea. ------------------------------------------------ I changed a lot here! Great Smite is no longer available, paladin spells no longer available past whatever you decide to do past 11 to wisdom, force more Bard than Paladin because of the BAB would be around 27, +STR, +Spells, NO Dexers, still some failure with armor/shield.
EDIT: Additional comments The bard, being your main focus is a caster class. So many have made comments about most bards being fighters. I believe with this combination the bard can be viable as 1st a caster, buffer, de-buffer, and then as a fighter.
Weapon Focus Scimitar, because if you get lucky and do hit, you will want to hit for as much as possible. This is made a bit easier by the ability to Critical on a much lower die cast.
In terms of using Races/Subraces with this build... BUR's are a reward for long hard hours of play. It should be granted then that the making of any class with a BUR would be an even larger reward depending on the overall focus the player went with. That's half the fun of HG! Infinite possibilities and none of them are the answer-all!
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Post by starlandra on Jan 27, 2007 1:19:43 GMT
is funky still looking at these?
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Post by starlandra on Jan 27, 2007 1:27:52 GMT
from another thread but quoted here to add to the discussion From prior posts, messing with monk flurry of blows and attacks per round in general is just a no go per Funky. Make sure it explicitly states that the monk cannot wield weapons via delimiting feats. May Not Have: Feat: Exotic Weapon Proficiency May Not Have: Feat: Martial Weapon Proficiency... or some such thing that very clearly stats how the Quasi cannot have weapons. Restrict the base races available - perhaps Human only? The last thing I want to see is another atomie, halfling, pixie monk build flying around smacking the living booha outta everything in site. Balance the AC with the Attack power. A dexer build with crazy attack abilities is just another dexer with crazy attack abilities. Maybe make the build rely on strength, wisdom, and a bit of dex as it's main feats.... or perhaps the bonus saves of Paladin CHAR rather than Cleric maybe? ---> Everyone loves a funny drunk! And the drunken masters are all funny guys and gals! Restrict the ability to splash classes or go more than 2 classes perhaps? The player must be 25Monk/15 other class. The player must have X str The player's dexerity is debuffed (thus decreasing AC) - you see a drunken master get the living tar beat out of them while they return the same no? - while in Flurry of Blows mode. While out of Flurry of blows mode, super power is not available to said Drunken Master etc... I LOVE the idea and would love to see the Quasi made a reality! -Res do you all agree? open to suggestions
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Post by khaine on Jan 27, 2007 17:20:14 GMT
Personally whenever I think of drunken monk I think of this: www.youtube.com/watch?v=00xE1pm-hhk2:05 - 5:52 + 6:41 - 11:22 xD Persoanally I have always wanted to see one... Also remember, the average anime character has 47 gallons of blood in their body, xD. xD
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Post by cathedralmaster on Jan 27, 2007 22:03:59 GMT
Any possibility some of the quasiclasses could get a changed appearance upon meeting the classes requirements?
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Post by bhao on Jan 27, 2007 23:14:22 GMT
2 Ideally, this should be able to be used to imbue either the Disciple's melee attacks or unarmed attacks with elemental damage. If I understand correctly, however, this is at best impractical to implement, so I've written the power to be limited to melee weapons. If it can be arranged to work for unarmed attacks, then so much the better. i think it should work only for unarmed attacks, if possible (applies to drunken monk too ). would make unarmed monks a lot more attractive. i also don't think anybody would use the stunning/death attacks, if they had to remove the weapon every time, unless the bonuses are huge. ...but if the limits of scripting get in the way of having all this unarmed, oh well. Any possibility some of the quasiclasses could get a changed appearance upon meeting the classes requirements? turn the monk into the respective druid elemental shape maybe? just remove the staff from the water (or was it air?) elemental. something i thought of yesterday. haven't refined it yet, but goes something like this: Divine Marksman:a paladin or cleric with xbow. second class is champion of torm. at level 20: - must have 10 levels torm. - must have the cleric domain good. - must have xbow focus. torm counts as caster levels for the following spells: - divine favor - divine power - buffs (stat buffs, protection spells, item buffs, regen) - summons - special version of divine favor, that uses the torm levels as magic damage bonus and torm levels/2 as attack bonus. lasts 1 turn/level - special version of divine power, that lasts 1 turn/level maybe have special xbows or endless bolt items, that only divine marksmen can use. what bugs me most about this idea atm is, that torm needs a melee weapon focus for this and that you could abuse the extra divine favor damage for something besides xbows - have to have some sort of check for that, i guess..
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Post by khaine on Jan 28, 2007 0:50:29 GMT
I like the idea of an Arcane Archer, but with a crossbow, but that would be boring - But then a divine marksman, puts a twist on it. Maybe if its "Marksman of The Faith", leaving which to your alignment. This would mean that any skills could be applied to diffrent builds, or maybe change the abilities with alignment, like good has a divine aligned attack, a healing ability and gets a nice buff. Evil has an Evil attack, a cursing attack, and a damage shield, xD.
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Post by exidorthequick on Jan 28, 2007 8:09:38 GMT
2 Ideally, this should be able to be used to imbue either the Disciple's melee attacks or unarmed attacks with elemental damage. If I understand correctly, however, this is at best impractical to implement, so I've written the power to be limited to melee weapons. If it can be arranged to work for unarmed attacks, then so much the better. i think it should work only for unarmed attacks, if possible (applies to drunken monk too ). would make unarmed monks a lot more attractive. If it's possible to add the extra damage to unarmed attacks, then I agree that it should be done, and limited to unarmed attacks as well. I only brought melee weapons into the mix because of the difficulty in implementing this effect for unarmed attacks. Unarmed combat suffers from several inherent drawbacks (virtual loss of an item slot and loss of access to several caster buffs, for example); I would love to see a quasiclass, such as this one, which gave advantages in return. Any possibility some of the quasiclasses could get a changed appearance upon meeting the classes requirements? turn the monk into the respective druid elemental shape maybe? just remove the staff from the water (or was it air?) elemental. That is a truly excellent suggestion. I'd suggest that a Disciple should change form to match his or her focus upon taking a 20th level of monk. At this point the Disciple gains the Perfect Self feat, signifying complete mastery of mind and body - which would be a logical point for the Disciple's focus to fully manifest itself through his or her outer form as well. Drunken MasterI like the Drunken Master concept in general, but it is a fairly well developed concept and deserves to be done right. I don't think it should be made into a quasiclass; Drunken Master should be a monk prestige class - which isn't an option for Higher Ground. I think it's better not to have a Drunken Master than to cobble together something artificial and call it a Drunken Master. Those concerns aside, if it is made into a quasiclass then I have a couple of comments to make on what others have said: • It was suggested that Drunken Master should focus more on Strength and Wisdom, and less on Dexterity, because Dex builds are overdone. I have a soft place in my heart for Monk Str builds (I know, I'm a fool), but Drunken Master is not the place for them. A Drunken Master does not defeat his foes by force, but rather by artful dodging and precise striking. He hides his prowess by stumbling about as if in a drunken stupor, such that an onlooker would swear that luck was the only cause of his victory. I would say that Wisdom should be a Drunken Master's prime attribute, and that it, rather than Str or Dex, should be used to calculate his to-hit bonuses. That, however, would require the addition of a feat (unless I'm mistaken), which makes a true implementation of Drunken Master (as I see it) unfeasable for Higher Ground. • I must whole-heartedly concur that a Drunken Master should receive bonuses for the consumption of drink. I can't imagine a legitimate Drunken Master concept without that. Divine Marksman ( see above) A couple of negative thoughts: • Champion of Torm is already a good fit with Paladin or Cleric, so this may not really call for a quasiclass. • The proposed improvements to Divine Favor and Divine Power seem very strong, perhaps good enough to draw someone to make a Divine Marksman and never use a ranged weapon. (I'm echoing bhao's own concern here.) Aside from that, I think this is an interesting concept. I've often thought that a Wisdom-based ranged combat character could be fun to play, but never been able to make one work to my satisfaction. It would be nice to see something like this quasiclass give the concept a boost. If some Divine-Marksman-only crossbows are added similar to the Arcane-Archer-bows then I could see this as a viable concept. Also, I like khaine's idea of opening it up to other alignments, with some alignment- or deity-specific abilities for the Marksman. Of course, this would be more work to implement. However, for balance purposes and to ensure that the quasiclass retains its intended focus, any spells that receive bonuses or which count Champion of Torm levels into their effect should be restricted in some way such that they are of little benefit when not wielding a crossbow. I see no problem with a Divine Marksman using a melee weapon when it suits their purposes, however their focus should remain on the crossbow.
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