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Post by fallenwizard on Feb 3, 2015 22:29:48 GMT
I'd also add that much like the minja, more attacks provides a very favorable adjustment to your flurries, translating to a noticeable improvement in dispatching trash quickly. And on that note (puke), coupling this with huge scythe crits means you can often instakill even 2-3 trashes in a round/1 in just your first flurry. It's not uncommon to see 2-3 crits in that 1st flurry. Vaguely funny to insta more than 1 mob per round; unlike MS there's no cap on how many 1500 crits you can land in a round :| Not entirely the case, great cleave is somewhat weird in its mechanics. I havent fully playtested it, since never gave it much of a value post lvl 20 play.. But it is something like you cleave if you still have atacks left on that flurry or if it is the final flurry of the round. So if your attacks go like 3 - 3 - 3, if you land the kill on 1st/2nd or 4th/5th you get a cleave, not on 3rd/6th. It says great cleave but doesnt actually hit it and then it begins the next round with the great cleave modified AB. It is somewhat weird. Also it can say the cleave, you stop attacking, walk to next map and then when you attack your first target, it THEN attacks the original cleaeve target even if minute has passed and area been transit. Anyways, if someone has done more experimenting with cleaves feel free to enlighten me.. Also sorry for off topic Herc.
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Post by chirality on Feb 4, 2015 2:18:31 GMT
What's not entirely the case? since never gave it much of a value post lvl 20 play.. Me neither. I didn't mention cleave cause only time i really intentionally cleave into things is when doing something either solo or in group/situation lacking fast caster killing. For purpose of this discussion, I'm never cleaving except by nab mistake, in fact I attempt to interrupt cleaves whenever possible. This is for a few reasons: 1, i'm really laggy and this means i misclick a lot and also go flat footed a lot because of it; 2, i have pretty high apm click habit which goes bit overboard on hg; and 3, even still i'm constantly spam clicking mobs or ground somewhere to try always gain any fraction of a second i can. unless it's some sup rachugon or pf-size hp mob, i'm usually not attacking for more than 2-3 flurries straight anyway with interrupting by moving or changing target/swapping weap anyway, so really cleave is only coming into play on some situation with low caster kill efficiency and thus a surplus of time for me to stand in one spot attacking in chainsequence a bunch of mobs surrounding me. if i'm surrounded by multiple stuff to cleave, it means i'm trying bash some non-instable high-hp target, and once it's dead i'm prolly immediately running 40 ft away for the next one; by that time casters have cleared trash anyway. cleave is nice for small patches of stuff like dust nec etc. but a nice thing about the flurry/atks/blah blah is when trying to kill healpot mobs.
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Post by Hercules on Feb 5, 2015 12:01:47 GMT
So I landed my weapon of choice, halberd and also 32 barbarian. now I gotta descide:
32barb / 5 HS / 3 fighter - for Weapon spec and mucho dmg 32barb / 5 HS / 3 Pally/BG - for uber saves and some immunities from pally levels. 32barb / 5 WM / 3 fighter - not likly....
I will make a test toon and check saves out before I make a hasty descition, or maybe ill just keep my precious tank right as it is, with halberd instead of dire mace for some more dmg, but not maxed....
Herc
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Post by fallenwizard on Feb 5, 2015 12:59:21 GMT
You need 4 ftr for wep specs, so it limits your barb level to 31 however.
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Post by Torin on Feb 5, 2015 17:57:17 GMT
i would go: 31barb / 5 HS / 4 fighter - for Weapon spec and mucho dmg Take Slipery Soul (Strong soul on level 1 and change with PCScry), Legend. Slippery Soul, Iron Will + Legend. Will and your Saves are fine. Iron Will is a requirement for Harper Scout anyway.
You must take the 4th Fighter feat in epic levels and take WS (Fighter bonus feat)+EWS (general bonus feat) on that levelup.
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Post by sabregirl on Feb 6, 2015 5:51:05 GMT
So I landed my weapon of choice, halberd and also 32 barbarian. now I gotta descide: 32barb / 5 HS / 3 fighter - for Weapon spec and mucho dmg 32barb / 5 HS / 3 Pally/BG - for uber saves and some immunities from pally levels. 32barb / 5 WM / 3 fighter - not likly.... I will make a test toon and check saves out before I make a hasty descition, or maybe ill just keep my precious tank right as it is, with halberd instead of dire mace for some more dmg, but not maxed.... Herc I have a 32 barb/5 HS/ 3 pal - and the saves are rather high (fort save is something like 80). Mind you I pumped charisma to help with intimidate and taunt. Perma fear immunity is nice but the extra damage you would get from fighter instead is nice as well. -S
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Post by Hercules on Feb 6, 2015 13:58:11 GMT
That is spot on the money SG. I wanna keep my AC and my awesome stats, besides that I dont mind changing. Can you perheps post a screenshot on your stats and AC ? My biggest thought is still, If I go HS I should use the HS boots? I got a Ego BUR mord boots with insane Pys imm on it, which I dont wanna loose.
PS: how did Cha pump intimidate and taunt, I must have missed something here .... Still remember Tyrans Moonbeam, my first Barbarian ever...
~Herc
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Post by Hercules on Feb 8, 2015 19:57:23 GMT
Here we go, my new go on a barbarian :-P Feedback are most welcome, thats why I decided to post this in the first place. ( Thank you for the nice formatting Semner !) This pic is from a MIN run I did today. - no deaths - won kills - won dmg output - 92% dodge rate Level
| Feats | Ability Score | 1 Barbarian | Blooded, Alertness |
| 2 Fighter | WF Halberd |
| 3 Fighter | Iron Will, Power attack |
| 4 Fighter |
| +1 STR | 5 Barbarian |
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| 6 Barbarian | Cleave |
| 7 Barbarian |
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| 8 Barbarian |
| +1 STR | 9 Barbarian | Great Cleave |
| 10 Barbarian |
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| 11 Barbarian |
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| 12 Barbarian | Greater weapon Focus Halberd | +1 STR | 13 Barbarian |
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| 14 Barbarian |
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| 15 Barbarian | Improved Critical Halberd |
| 16 Barbarian |
| +1 STR | 17 Barbarian
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| 18 Barbarian | Power Critical Halberd |
| 19 Barbarian | |
| 20 Barbarian |
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| 21 Barbarian | Epic WF Halberd | +1 STR | 22 Barbarian |
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| 23 Barbarian |
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| 24 Fighter | Weapon Spec + Epic Weapon Spec |
| 25 Harper Scout | Great Dex 1
| +1 STR | 26 Harper Scout |
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| 27 Harper Scout | Great Char 1 |
| 28 Harper Scout |
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| 29 Barbarian |
| +1 STR | 30 Barbarian | Armor Skin |
| 31 Barbarian |
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| 32 Barbarian | Overwhelming Crit Halberd |
| 33 Barbarian | Epic Prowess | +1 STR | 34 Barbarian |
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| 35 Barbarian |
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| 36 Barbarian | Devastating Critical (Halberd) + Thundering Rage |
| 37 Barbarian |
| +1 STR | 38 Barbarian |
| | 39 Barbarian | Terrifying Rage |
| 40 Harper Scout | Epic Will | +1 Char
| 41 CC Barb |
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| 42 CC Barb | Leg Weapon Spec | +1 STR | 43 CC Barb |
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| 44 CC Barb |
| +1 STR | 45 CC Barb | Legendary Weapon Focus (Halberd) |
| 46 CC Barb |
| +1 STR | 47 CC Barb |
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| 48 CC Barb | Leg Will | +1 STR | 49 CC Barb |
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| 50 CC Barb |
| +1 STR | 51 CC Barb | Leg Str I |
| 52 CC Barb |
| +1 STR | 53 CC Barb |
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| 54 CC Barb | Leg Str II | +1 STR | 55 CC Barb | (Use CON Arti) |
| 56 CC Barb |
| +1 STR | 57 CC Barb | LSA Tumble |
| 58 CC Barb |
| +1 STR | 59 CC Barb |
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| 60 CC Barb | Mighty Rage | +1 STR |
Paragon Feat:-Paragon WF -Paragon Weapon Spec - rest is not decided yet.
| Creation
| naked at 60
| Total at 60 with double demi and arti
| Str | 16
| 46 | 66 | Dex | 16
| 22 | 42 | Con | 16
| 22 | 42 (44 with arti) | Int | 8
| 10 | 30 | Wis | 8
| 6 | 26 | Char | 8
| 8 | 28 |
I think save numbers might be off. During test chamber I took hardened Soul + Leg Hardened Soul ( could not swap via Scry), so I should be subtracting 5 to Fort and Will ? Either way, Saves should be fine, so I chose to boost Tumble to 60 and get 5 more AC than I would otherwise.
| at lvl 60 naked | at lvl 60 with +16 gear, double demi | Fort | 38 | 66 | Reflex | 27 | 59 | Will | 40 | 63 |
Points:Craft Weapon 60 Craft Armor 60 Concentration 30 Tumble 60 Discipline 60 Listen 60 Intimidate 60 Taunt 60 Must have (req for HS): Search 4 Lore 6 Persuade 8 I would like to thank all those who have contributed in ideas, tweaks and answering all my questions. Sincerely ~Herc
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Post by sabregirl on Feb 9, 2015 3:59:26 GMT
Are you really taking great charisma I and not great dex II? Charisma doesn't make a lot of sense plus it would leave your dex odd. Also base race and subrace? Don't think you're going to have enough points for all those skills with only 8 int, would be missing a skill you've listed with only 10 also. 30 UMD is for GS scrolls and BBoDs. If you want to use another source of GS or buy wands, you don't need it. No point in going HS if you're not going to use the boots. Intimidate and taunt are both charisma based so it's harder to max them when you only have 8 CHA. Ty's barb is malephant and it gets ESF intimidate to make up for cha. Max intimidate (127) gives you 63 DC on your fear aura, which gives a -2 to AB and saves. Otherwise best you can do is 61. -S
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Post by Hercules on Feb 9, 2015 8:28:39 GMT
Are you really taking great charisma I and not great dex II? Charisma doesn't make a lot of sense plus it would leave your dex odd. I spent 2 points in Char to boost it from a whopping 6, to 8. With 2 point from paragon lvl I will end up at 30,which is alot better than 22 in previous build.In previous build I had some problems with Domination. Was trying to avoid some more checks. Maybe it is a waste of points. Regarding odd Dex... Hmmm I didnt get it odd, I did a test character in chambers too....maybe I forgot to put in another dex point/ greter dex somewhere / one str point too much instead of dex? ? (Might be lvl 40) Will check it when I get home.Also base race and subrace? Human Koly.Don't think you're going to have enough points for all those skills with only 8 int, would be missing a skill you've listed with only 10 also. 30 UMD is for GS scrolls and BBoDs. If you want to use another source of GS or buy wands, you don't need it. Well I got rods for BBod, and pots for GS, so I might aswell drop UMD then -P Vichya posted that Int 8 would be enough to max 6 selections of skills. I didn't test it but should be enough now that I free up 30 points from not taking UMD too.No point in going HS if you're not going to use the boots. I will use the boots. I debated that 2 attacks more > than 5% and a little more Rage.( i must admit it hurts leaving such a good pair of boots in the bank chest)Intimidate and taunt are both charisma based so it's harder to max them when you only have 8 CHA. Ty's barb is malephant and it gets ESF intimidate to make up for cha. Max intimidate (127) gives you 63 DC on your fear aura, which gives a -2 to AB and saves. Otherwise best you can do is 61. Either I go with Fear aura of DC 61, or I might check if I can fit ESF intimidate in paragon levels/ invest in a few more points intimidate during paragon lvl up. Will post paragon levlels later.-S ~Herc
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Post by Hercules on Feb 9, 2015 18:42:33 GMT
Checked it again SG, look right to me. (no odd dex)
~Herc
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Post by Twilight Semner on Feb 9, 2015 18:54:54 GMT
It looks like you're going to have a total of 303 skill points available. Harper Scout prereqs are going to cost you 30, since Search and Persuade are both cross-class for both fighter and barbarian, leaving you with 273 points. You have 330 skill points listed on your build above. I would suggest dropping starting constitution by 2, and increasing your starting intelligence by 4. It'll give you another 126 skill points, allowing you to take the skills you have listed above, as well as max an additional skill. With con arti, you'll still have enough to take mighty rage at 60 (14 base + 2 koly + 3 barb CC + 2 arti = 21).
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Post by Hercules on Feb 9, 2015 20:28:41 GMT
How did you get con odd? barb CC adds con for every 5 lvl in Legendary, doesnt it, so it should be 4 ?
Hmm, if I will drop Con by 2, it will add me 4 points.. If I distribute them in 2 int, 2 char I could up my char a bit too. :-) That will give me a 32 char in the end. (dont need the extra skills, although it would be nice with CW or CA)
Herc
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Post by Twilight Semner on Feb 9, 2015 20:35:25 GMT
It's not odd at 60. The only reason I showed it that way was because the last point of con doesn't apply until after you take the level and therefore can't be used to qualify for Mighty Rage.
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Post by tomaan on Feb 9, 2015 20:39:05 GMT
Are you really taking great charisma I and not great dex II? Charisma doesn't make a lot of sense plus it would leave your dex odd. I spent 2 points in Char to boost it from a whopping 6, to 8. With 2 point from paragon lvl I will end up at 30,which is alot better than 22 in previous build.In previous build I had some problems with Domination. Was trying to avoid some more checks. Maybe it is a waste of points. Regarding odd Dex... Hmmm I didnt get it odd, I did a test character in chambers too....maybe I forgot to put in another dex point/ greter dex somewhere / one str point too much instead of dex? ? (Might be lvl 40) Will check it when I get home.-S Hate to recommend gear-dependency, but will Folds of Fury prevent domination as well as confusion? Also gives some Int bonus and extra rages....might be worth the item slot. And thanks for the revisit -- I have a barb gathering cyber-dust and am following this thread very closely.
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