Battlecleric Spell Schools

[kaezar]

Started cogitating reincarnating my battlecleric a few days ago, to up his damage.

With the new paragon spells, and other past and upcoming changes, what do you people thing are the best schools of magic? I'm tending getting Abjuration and Divinations at PSF, with PSK, and going PSF (without PSK) on Enchantment. Although the last gives me big doubts.

Abjuration gives Dispel and Greater Dispelling (a minor consideration), buffs, like Energy Immunity. Also I suspect Aegis will be a much loved epic once the new damage types come into play, possibly with Elder Evils. Other than that, Permanency will be lovely in places like Sheddeklah (if that's how you write it) and the Coil on Nessus.

Divination has Miracle, Gate, Serenditipious Forethought all of which are all good, and the biggie, Augury with the ability to absorve up to, iirc, 8 Dispel/Breach/Mord attempts, which is a biggie for a battlecleric. And a minor on clairaundience, which wll allow to max Listen easily.

I guess my biggest doubt is the last school. I won't be able to get PSK on it, so it is not a factor. Maybe PSF, but it will cost me 2 AB from Paragon Weapon Focus, which I'll have to drop for it. Think LSF (+14 weapon) + Gird is enough to bother? Battlecleric, so won't have a ton of slots to gmw the whole party anyway.

Or maybe IoF? +16 to whole party is the only thing that may come out of transmutatiin school. It seems to be relatevely easy to get +15 gmw on parties nowadays.

Thoughts on it?

Take care
Kaezar

[Yojimbo]

I think Abj, Div, and Ench is best picks for a BC if the party doesn't get a caster cleric with IoF or a Pariah, I think they max at +16, then they can just settle for +15 which should be plenty sufficient. I think that is the planned schools I have for my BC if I get the race I want though IIRC Abjuration allows you to give yourself a sort of GotF.

[KnightErrant]

Magic Vestment with PSF enchant ? or is it Trans ? while wearing the Ely Divine Immunity Plate is pretty sweet...


KE.

[chirality]

Abj (I think what jimbo was referring to also--caps at +20)

[desocupado]

Magic vestment is abjuration, it also affects shields, keep that in mind that having a CL below 60 reduces it's effectiveness.

For a third school, personally I'd recommend ESF Trans, since most casters clerics tend to have Enchantment over Transmutation anyway.

Apr 29, 2013 20:45:42 GMT kaezar said:

Started cogitating reincarnating my battlecleric a few days ago, to up his damage.

Fighter 4 Paladin 1 splash then?

[kaezar]

Probably. Also have an item to give OC/DC so that's not a consideration, I thought I could fit it with 1 less school

Take care
Kaezar

[Torin]

PSF + PSK div gives x2 miracle, serendipitous forethought, gate soak, 8 charges on augury, and +32 CC.
PSF enchantment gives +15 GMW and girding x2
PSF abjuration gives +18 magic vestment(stacks with girding), 100% EI, Aegis x 2, +17 shield of faith, 24/- resist with resist elements, and 68 dispel roll for greater dispelling.

[arek]

kaezar, your real question is whether or not PSF Enchantment (sans psk) is worth 2 AB, right? The answer to this is "it depends". What's your AB going to be like on this toon? If it gets 99 or higher AB at 60 with +14 stats, +50 CW, and without counting Demi iterations (not counting either PWF or Paragon Levels either, ofc), then I say it's probably worth it. At 97-98 AB under the same circumstances, it's debatable. Below 97 AB, I'd say get PWF instead.

--Arek

[kaezar]

Yeah, it is a bit more than that, though.

I can fit ESF Enchantment with no problem. To get LSF, I would have to bump a great strength feat, and getting the strength point back would be expansive. And, as I said, gettng PSF would mean kicking PWF.

Giving that the AB of the character is 98 before Craft Weapon - which I mostly don't count - there included Greater Weapon Focus, Strength Arty and double demi, I really don't think I have a lot of wriggle room to drop AB. The gird and +13 is mostly good enough, and I can drink a draught to reach +14 in a pinch.

Now I am going to probably go that way, unless I (or somebody else) have some incredible idea on the next few hours. Mostly playing with wing schemes on pharlan now.

Take care
Kaezar

[Yojimbo]

I would keep PSF+PSK for Div and Abju the question is ESF Trans vs PSF Ench you should be bale to reach +20 total magical AB buff with either option so it is a question of the value of +15 Enhancement & +2 Shield & Armor AC vs +16 Enhancement and saving 2 feats. With the idea of saving 2 feats 1 Paragon and 1 Legendary it certainly beginning to make the Trans option much more appealing. I don't find the Paragon spell for either Enchantment or Transmutation all that great. The transmutation Paragon spell would require investing 2 more feats into the school for the Foci requirement but you gain almost nothing besides a Paragon spell. The enchantment Paragon spell I don't think would stack with your own Divine Favor spell so even with it providing a bonus to the party it is not worth the investment and the benefits of the other spells is far more appealing.

[desocupado]

If you can try:
1 - PSK Div
2 - PSF Abj (extra AC / energy immunity spell)
3 - Paragon Weapon Spec (since you have free feats from OC/DC)
4 - ESF Trans (probably forced due tome of spell knowledge and pre-epic feats)

If there is still a Paragon feat - PSK Abjuration might be best, for the reason you stated (need for esoteric immunity/resistances in new areas)

[Yojimbo]

You get 6 Paragon Feats

#1 PWF
#2 PSF Div
#3 PSK Div
#4
#5
#6

If you got 2 schools to LSF prior to PLs you can easily fit PSF+PSK and PWS if not it is a choice then of if you want PWS or another Paragon Spell. I think at this point it might help to see a rough draft of the build Kaezer.

[kaezar]

In fact I got only one free feat, as I have decided to go PSF/PSK abjuration already. Other than that, yojimbo is right on my choices.

As it stands now, outside those feats, I got 3 feats, 2 pre-epic and 1 epic free, enought to get 1 more school at epic. To get more, I would need to bump a legendary feat. The options are LSA Listen and Tumble, Legendary weapon focus, legendary weapon specialization, legendary Spell Focus Abjuration, Legendary Spell Focus Divination and Great Strength. Last one is the only I feel I could possibly sacrifice for LSF: Enchantment. Then I would have to give up Paragon Weapon Focus to get Paragon Spell Focus: Enchantment for the +15.

Strenght is already at 16, so to up it to compensate I would have to drop some other ability by 2 and another by 1, since they are all at 14 or less. I can't drop wisdom without being in the same place. Int would drop the non-plentiful skill points of a cleric. I could drop charisma by 1 withoug loss, but dropping dexterity, which is not high, would influence AC and dex checks, and con is not high to begin with. Alternative would be drop strength.

And that gets only around LSF. For PSF, no way around it, I would have to drop Paragon Weapon Focus. That's why I probably am sticking with ESF: Enchantment. I would never be able to fit enough slots to hit the whole party anyway, so it would be only for backup weapons. So I will leave it for bards, caster clerics, pariahs and heralds, and the odd enchantment mage. And Paladins. And blackguards.

Take care
Kaezar

[Vichya]

I would take

PSF Divintation for better gate,
PSF Enchantment for Girding and +15 GMW and
LSF or PSF Abjuration for +18 armor bonus on magic vestment depending on whether you have a good CL ego item or not.

[kaezar]

Debated this a lot with myself. In the end I decided for

PSF/PSK Divination Gate, 2x Miracle and Serenditipious Forethought
PSF/PSK Abjuration Buffs, Aegis and Permanency
PWF
PWS

ESF Enchantment Gird and gmw +13

I arrived at that for various reasons.

I don't think I have to justify PSF/PSK Divination and PWS, do I?

1 - nowadays there are a lot of classes that give +15 gmw, in special bards, and even some other than cleric that give +16, like Pariahs and Heralds. Anyway, the number of spellslots this character has - 10 - hardly allows to gmw the party, even if you exclude buffs.

2 - I suspect the ability to give Aegis will become very important for Elder Evils. As the only class able to give those abstruse resists, it will be crucial for the party to have it. Also, permanency is a great boon to the party on the coil, Asmo fight and sheddeklah. As the only partywide way to prevent slagging I think it is important to have it.

3 - I hate reincarnating even more now that I lose about 5 million xp to do it. If I am wrong about the gmw, I will have to join only parties with another gmw'r/iof'r. If I am right about aegis/permanency and don't have it, it is back to the light again.

4 - Petty but true. I hate getting debuffed by abos. Having a way (Greater Dispelling) to dispel them will be... satisfying.

The reincarnation is done, since I am going to have to visit a sick grandparent and will not be around for the next few days, this is it. Thanks for all the input and help.

Take care
Kaezar