Reincarnation advice request

[magecat]

I have an OLD pure rogue crossbow build. It is a Pixie that was built using the Click build.

I would like to put that investment back to use, but I didn't think crossbow builds are effective. Does anyone have suggestions?

Edit:
I realize that getting there will take a while (2x Reincarnations), but I was thinking of this:

"Pixie" (secret; changes Appearance) - Human
- STR -2, CON -2, DEX +2, INT +2, WIS +2, CHA +2, +2 listen, +2 search, +2 spot, increased base movement rate - very fast, SR 10 + 1/lvl, free feat: Low-Light Vision, free feat: Dodge, reduces character size to small, able to walk on quicksand, speaks Sylvan, speaks Pixie

highergroundpoa.proboards.com/thread/21230/ace-trades-bard-paladin-rogue

Anyone willing to evaluate whether that build is viable?

[arek]

Pure rogues are still good, it's just that, with all the physical resists now in the mod, xbow rogues are hosed (for ranged, sneaks are not included in the main damage packet, so physical resists are effectively doubled for them), tho they do make okay picker/searcher/banker toons that can still do some damage.

If you want to try making a pure rogue, there are a few builds around that work - try to find one with "universal" stats that (somehow) gets both shield proficiency and the two-weapon fighting line for the best combination of offense and defense, or (with a different race) a 2-hander build (which requires amazing gear, including a lot of aboleths farming (for the concealment helm - you want at least 3 of them).

I'll edit this with comments about the bard in a moment.

--arek

[magecat]

In regard to higher tier races, I have several unlocked, but do not currently have any books for reinc sacrifice since I am just returning.

[desocupado]

Given Paragon levels and paragon spells, I wouldn't splash rogue into a bard (or any other caster). They are already pretty feat starved as they are.

Although, with an adequate subrace it's possible to have rogue without many drawbacks on something like Str Assassin . But it's still a chore, since you'll have to rely on gear swap and GR/Restoration. And it's still a bit costly, since you are not splashing something more powerful like monk, paladin, bg, wm, fighter (or having that tasty CL).

Truth be told, it's better to be a rogue and do rogue duties due stuff like skill mastery (pure Rogue), take 20 and so on.

---

The big questions are:

1 What do you like about a rogue? (There are better dexters, tankier classes and overall more effective ranged builds with other classes)
2 Do you really want to keep a rogue? (If not, make a long reincarnation chain)
3 Do you really think you will like playing a Bard?

[arek]

For the 2-hander, please note that I didn't say "better" or "higher-tier", but rather "different". Pixie, for example, is unlikely to work for a 2-hander (with only a -2 str it's possible, but would require a lot of str-pumping), but Daywalker could pull it off easily enough, as could Kurai, Prismatic Half-Dragon (HD, Prismatic), or Minotaur (with a huge weapon), all of which are Secret-tier, if you don't feel like book-hunting. The besxt non-XR races would be either Koly, Half-Guardinal, or perhaps Undying, ofc, but of those only Undying is gonna be any kind of easy to get these days.

Now to address the bard build...man, that thing is old. First, dex-based bards suck. They don't do good damage and they miss out on being able to land lots of spells. They're decent tanks, but that's it, and without the damage and/or spells to back up that tanking ability, they're simply inferior to CHA-based bards.

I'm not saying that the picker-bard isn't possible...it is. But you really want to first build a Support/Caster bard (trust me - properly played, these do FAR more damage than any melee bard), and then think about adding the ability to pick locks to it. For this to work decently, you're going to need a BUR or XR race - specifically, either Undying or Deathless - to make up for the fact that you simply cannot afford a paladin level on a picker bard, since bards rely on concealment and AC as much as (or perhaps even more than) %imms for defense, and a 2-splash permanently reduces conceal by a minimum of 5%.

I hope this helps you and/or points you in the right direction.

--arek

Edit: Deso has a point about bards being feat-starved. This is why you really must use undying or deathless for a picker-bard. No other races come close when alleviating the need for save feats when not splashing pally/bg. Even with these races, you may need to drop an epic for a couple of save feats. And don't think you can skimp on saves...bards are front-line tanks in addition to being casters. Failing saves regularly is something they cannot afford.