Upgrades for Abyssal Vestiges

[Deleted]

I'd imagine flat power, the zots required for super nice / fun things I don't imagine they'll get, especially because most of them don't have that to begin with.

[drunkenboastor]

For the cloak Sowing the Seeds of Death:
- I think a 3 use per day pick up after knockdown should be added.
-- On all my casters that would benefit from the special that Sowing the Seeds of Death, I use Shroud of the Demon Bat because people steal my kills when I am knocked down .
-- For Barbarians and Dragon Disciples, while this cloak in effect gives them 1 more AC by lowering enemy AB by 1 extra, they are hurt by removing Wrap of Dark Prince as an option. If SToD had pickup, for tank types the Tragidore belt for Divine Power could be more appealing.
- I think the cloak should have a different appearance. The one it has now is very ugly, and after buffing with stoneskin or shadow shield, the lower part that is normally invisible becomes visible and looks dumb.

[drunkenboastor]

For the Shield Abyssal Retort
- I think this item needs to be totally blown up with everything removed. The list of characters that would use a tower shield in the end game is very short, only those that would use heavy armor. At the end game, besides Shifters, the only real users of heavy armor are pure Clerics and builds with Auto Still Spell feats.
- Add AoE effect to the Bestow Curse spell.
-- Bestow curse is kind of a specialty spell for most heavy armor users
-- It would be even better if it was able to work with Undead Shifter's Specter shape.
- Add when casting Bestow Curse spell, caster level is 10 higher.
-- This would increase the spell resistance lowering by 2 more, totaling 14 sr drop in the case of a level 60 caster, would cap out in effect at 16 if cast by a 10/30 Pale Master build powered up by 2 drained levels.
- Would change the skills to Persuade (BK, PM, Cleric), Taunt (Pariah), and Craft Armor. Perhaps one other skill added, but would not add Parry or any other silly skill like Appraise, Move Silently, etc... I would also suggest adding ESF Taunt and ESF Persuade.
- Resists of sort should be added as well, 20/- to physical, 20/- exotics, or 35/- to elements.

[woqued]

Feb 6, 2019 20:30:54 GMT @xprepared said:

I'd imagine flat power, the zots required for super nice / fun things I don't imagine they'll get, especially because most of them don't have that to begin with.

I'd imagine that too, yet I ask. 

[sabregirl]

I have a list of proposed changes posted here and on the OP.

The plan is to allow people with the maximum number of vestiges to visit a certain place and have all of them reset to unclaimed vestiges, which can then be claimed again.

-S

[manuka]

A few questions

firstly what you put as current for esoteric exotic is different than the wiki?

30 physical on chaotic devotion means what? 30 soak +20?

sowing seeds of death says 35 physical resist? to only 1 or all of them?

there are some massive buffs here and it might be better to just let anyone with vestiges refund them for unused ones.
I personally have been only doing 4 abyss cycles on a toon because the last one doesn't stack with p2hard win. Or so i have been told

is the reset all vestiges to unclaimed going to be a one time thing for each character?

[woqued]

They look quite nice! Very nice.

Proposed reset function sounds just fine. Particularly if it only requires visiting a place after you've capped out. Sure hope it's not a onetime thing.

[chirality]

i'd imagine/hope anywhere "physical" is left unspecified it's all 3.

i kind of feel like 18 ac on horrified silence is a bit much? even non-caster XR small shield is only 17. i mean don't get me wrong, i'm down to *buff* these things. just seems a lil off the normal shield ac trend. maybe just a copypasta error tho.

(and on the other hand, 19 ac on ammy feels right, gudgud)

also, on a different subject but still shield-related...mind explaining Funky's note there about a "future shield balancing update"?

[drunkenboastor]

The belt Wasting Away, why add ESF heal to it? It is not likely that any spell caster is going to give up a belt slot for what appears to be an upgraded version of the BUR, Belt of Legendary Resilience. Does a belt that gives immunity to disease need to have an ability to remove disease? I would never select this vestige for any character.

The glove Chaotic Devotion, would you consider adding elemental resists instead of physical? There are no BUR or set loot equivalent glove slot items that have all five elemental resists. Currently Chaotic Devotion is being changed to an upgraded version of the BUR, Guantlets of Transposed Energy, I would argue after that Chaotic Devotion after upgrade is inferior to the XR physical resist gloves. The special ability I have never tested, but I would think the caster level 55 Prayer spell would be limited use because of spell penetration issues. 

The helmet Visage of Elemental Chaos is an item I have never selected because it has a defensive field. If it keeps that defensive field, I will continue to never select it. 

The Cloak Sowing the Seeds of Death needs an appearance change or an invisible option. It looks dumb when buffing with Stoneskin or Shadow Shield, the lower part of the cloak that is normally not visible becomes visible.
 
An item with immunity to Dispel and Greater Dispel Magic would make sense. There are many sources of Greater Dispel in Abyss, but there is nothing from the Abyss for protection from it.

The armor class adjustments seem inconsistent to me, should make all the deflection AC +19.

I am hopeful that shield's armor class is balanced. It does not make sense to me that tower shields are lower armor class value than small or medium shields. 

[greven]

At first glance, it seems unlikely I would ever use most of the new vestiges. I'd be more likely to use them if they covered things that are really important, but rarely found on current items, like dispel immunity, divine power, etc.

I'd also be more likely to use them if they covered multiple sets of resists; like how the asmo cloak covers elemental and exotic resist. For example, a glove could cover elemental resists at a good, high rate, then also cover physical at, say, -15 or -20.

[woqued]

I wouldn't get carried away. How strong do you want the vestiges to be? Stronger than asmo artis in raw power + have specials? Compareable to well randomized XRs? Seems a tad ludicrous to me. I would use multiple pieces of these new options and I'm by no means poor; and these new options give a lot more versatility for gearing.

I agree the conf imm helmet defensive field is unneeded, but that's partially because pw ring is overrated and the helm is underrated. I've used it to good success on multiple characters.

ESF:Heal on the belt is a bit odd, seems to only work for... Threaders? Others won't use, more of a thematic bonus. The disintegrate immunity is really cool though, usually only found on almost empty items and can not be randomized to gear(?) - so there shouldn't be too much raw power in that belt imo if the disint is present. Perhaps that one could have something else but honestly, another item that I was also tempted to underrate. With other slots stacked in XR I feel it would become one of the better swappable vestiges for Limbo - but not for me for a while. But I -can- see gear setups where I would use it over the other stuff.

The only equipment in vestige lineup that "could" have dispel imm are the odd boots (before e-dodge), esoteric exotica (mord fits better and dispel would make it OP OP), and some of the torches. Others would break balance imo.

[greven]

Threaders need spell slots even more desperately than casters, so they could never afford to wear a belt item without spell slots. Not that any are around in deep runs, anyway.

As far as some kind of abstract, general view on how strong the changed vestiges should be, I want the vestiges that are going to be changed, because they aren't used, to be as powerful as the vestiges that are currently being used. It takes many, many cool things to make up for one necessary or necessary adjacent thing, particularly if only a handful of items in the game cover the necessary thing. For example, the breach boots vestige has four things that are frequently needed or nearly needed covered (breach, phys resist, stone imm, discipline), one such thing partially covered (phys imm %), and some cool things.

[sabregirl]

Just FYI whenever physical or exotic is mentioned I mean all of the types for the particular value indicated.

Vestiges are not really intended to compete with the strongest and well randomized XR items.

ESF heal was a sort of flavor addition.

-S

[rainbowdash]

would it be feasible for a vestige just to be a crafting item that could change or remove wings tails, haircolor, hairstyle?

It's something that bugs me for a little while now that if you want to play a certain race u have to make due with it having white wings or something of the like.

Pharlan is really cool in that regard that u can color the wings in character creation but then there is that weird tail.

If this was a server dedicated to roleplaying I could see why there shouldn't be a reason to change it but with it being mostly actionbased it would be really cool to give players some more freedom to tinker with the esthetics.

There would be many pros/cons to why it should/nt be a vestige. But I think it would be a nice reward for people who dedicated a lot of time to that specific toon to be able to change the appearance a little (most people wouldnt take it as 1st or 2nd vestige anyway so it would really be a lot of time invested or power giving up for it).

[drunkenboastor]

Thanks for the update and upgrades

Thank you for changing the appearance of Sowing the seeds of Death cloak.

The Cape of the Blood War General, Google doc says it is getting dexterity and axiomatic resists added, the one I have did not change like the other vestiges did.