Spell Immunes Available on Gear?

[FunkySwerve]

Hi all, another follow-up question in statting Mechanus: What specific spell immunities are currently available on gear?

And, as a corollary, how common are those immunes?

By way of example: harm, drown, implode, etc.

As another corollary, which are available on set loot which can be predictably obtained? Specific examples of set loot would help, though are not terribly important.

Thanks,
Funky

[chainlink]

If you have a look at the spells on HGwiki I've noted down gear that I know has immunity for most of the nasty (higher than level 6 ones), such as Implode and Weird and things that cover petrification (spell or effect).

[simpetar]

The list can be long, I will try my best. These are the run defining spell immunities, in order from the common to the rare:

1. Harm / Mass harm. Found on variety of lowbie gear as well as LL sets and UR. The usefulness is somewhat diminished, because all it takes to counter Harm is neg potion.
2. Implosion. This is one of the oldest instakills in the mod, with corresponding amount of immunity gear. Some set items are: Ssithrak Skirmisher Scale, Tragidore robes, Penumbrium Plate, Cruel Relief, Asmo shield, Asmo belt, Crown of Corruption, Integrity Ward and many URs and BURs.
3. Breach and Mord. Do I need to elaborate? Breach is commonly found on rings, set and random boots, cloaks or Thaumaturgic Nullifier (aboleth shield). Mord is commonly found on rings or Breach in the Weave (limbo 2 boots).
4. Bigby 6-9. Typically found together, although Bigby 5 is rarely included. For instance Ectoplasmic Weave or Asmo cloak, Asmo shield and many URs and BURs.
5. Flesh to Stone. Found for instance on Asmo plate, Sandals of Perdurance, Integrity Ward, GLory of Toril and some randoms (e.g. Splint of Elril).
6. Disintegrate. Found on Cruel Relief, Penumbrium Plate, Integrity Ward.
7. Weird. Found on Empyrean Lenses, Logos, Horrified Silence.
8. PWK. Found for instance on Mortal Failings, Essence of the Last Word, Logos or Lifebane Crown. If you are absolutely desperate, you can buy Lathar's Last Belt in item shop.
9. Dispel. Found on Eldritch Circle, Chaos Ward and a lowbie cleric helm that can be equipped with sufficient UMD.

Some niche spells that are not strictly required for runs, but can be handy:

1. Earthquake. Asmo plate and Gyroscope.
2. Meteor Swarm. Position of Power and some URs and BURs. Note that Meteor Swarm (arcane) is a different spell than Bombardment (druid). Bombardment has no immunity as far as I know, and can be equally as deadly.
3. Finger of Death. Similar case as Harm, can be countered by neg potion or shadow potion. For instance Asmo cloak.
4. Drown. Found on basic water ring, Penumbrium Plate and more.
5. Spell Immunity: Silence. Different from Immunity: Silence. Currently useful in Ely and Abo if the bard is busy/slacking. Found Logos for instance, or can be easily added by augmenter.
6. Great Thunderclap. Mostly needed for Limbo (eolians). Found on Talisman of Pazunia, some URs (Plate of Thokul Zeben), can be added with Quixart's aug.
7. ILMS + IGMS. Mainly on lowbie gear, because IGMS mostly appear in lowbie areas.
8. Word of Faith.

Special case immunities:

1. Items / potions with Shadow Shield. Blanket protection from all necromancy, including some really nasty ones - Wail, FoD, Destructs etc. Can be found virtually on all caster staves and accessories, others can drink potions.
2. Spell immunity to level X. Lvl 6 is the highest that can (as far as I know) spawn on items. Asmo amulet has unlimited casts of (dispellable) CL 60 Globe of Invulnerability giving immunity to 7 and below.
3. There are series of set shields from LL runs that each give specific immunity to wide array of elemental damage spells: Redscale Bastion (fire), Abhorrent Cold (cold), Chitinous Curtain (acid), Star of the Deep (sonic) and pretty sure there is one for elec (from Rona?), but can't seem to find it right now
4. Set of rings from Abyss, each gives blanket immunity to a whole spell school.
5. Spell Immunity: Entangle + Spell Immunity: Contagion. I suspect these protect from scripted abilities, rather than the actual spells.

Complete outliers that get used rarely (if ever), but are present on gear nonetheless:

1. Bestow Curse (Humbaba's Cruel Heart)
2. Mind Fog (Many as One)
3. ED + Enervate (Bonds of Decay)
4. Storm of Vengeance
5. Hammer of Gods
6. Creeping Doom (Thoraxian Shell)
and many more

[chirality]

there's pretty much something with immunity to almost any offensive spell in the game, to be honest. immunity:spell is actually probably one of the more common slotmachine addons for random gear, and probably one of the more common properties found on setloot as well; there's just a whole lot of immunities to be found. i know that's not specific at all, but simp's list is fairly exhaustive so I'm just adding that as an afterthought/summary--in a nutshell, the list of spells that gear doesn't supply immunities for (via either setloot or random) is probably far shorter. That said, there is a list of spells I would mention as being "casted by endgame mobs" so are valuable to have, but are either extremely rare to find on randomized gear and lack any truly wearable setpiece options. For example, polar ray afaik only has immunity on the dulv shield (of which simp mentioned above), which clearly isn't ever going to be worn by anybody, and if it exists as a slotmachine prop, i've never seen or heard of it.

to question p2, it's fairly common for a player to own at least 1-2 "wearable" (aka, decently-randomized on top of a decent base item that can be included in a kit without too much hassle) items with added immunity to a "good" spell, like implosion or StF, but in practice these are at best worn as swap-on pieces for a spawn or map, maybe a run-specific kit, but unless it's something godly, relying on setloot to provide needed spell imms is generally the case. mostly these items are fairly useless alone or provide low added value other than the spell imm, although there's also some cases like implosion where there's various options that are actually quite good items, in and of themselves, and wearing them specifically for the spell imm is not much of a sacrifice (asmo shield/belt, CoC).

[Deleted]

Simp's list covers it as mentioned. Anything notable is there. Level 6 Spell immunity is quite accessible for players too I might add. Getting it on ideal pieces is another story though.

[FunkySwerve]

Mar 12, 2020 15:39:15 GMT @prepared said:

Simp's list covers it as mentioned. Anything notable is there. Level 6 Spell immunity is quite accessible for players too I might add. Getting it on ideal pieces is another story though.

Good point. I should've probably restricted my list to 6+, but it's good to have some lower-levels in there as well.

Thanks,
Funky

[FunkySwerve]

Mar 12, 2020 8:52:55 GMT simpetar said:

The list can be long, I will try my best. These are the run defining spell immunities, in order from the common to the rare:

Exactly what I was looking for, thank you.

Funky

[simpetar]

Mar 12, 2020 20:20:40 GMT FunkySwerve said:

Mar 12, 2020 15:39:15 GMT @prepared said:

Simp's list covers it as mentioned. Anything notable is there. Level 6 Spell immunity is quite accessible for players too I might add. Getting it on ideal pieces is another story though.

Good point. I should've probably restricted my list to 6+, but it's good to have some lower-levels in there as well.

Thanks,
Funky

Immunity to lvl X and below does not always protect from all spell effects. Typically spells that ignore SR (and also go through mantles and spell level imm) and cloud spells - only specific spell immunities protect from those. Also some on hit effects: you may have imm to 6 and below, but Sphere of Annihilation can still disint you on hit, despite Disint being lvl 6 spell.

[chainlink]

I always found it a bit sad that Disintegrate immunity also gave immunity to Detonate meaning there's a load of stuff you can't detonate because it has specific immunity to the low level spell.

[FunkySwerve]

The only way to unwind it would be to make a list of distintegrateables, and then flag which should be detonate vulnerable. It's quite an undertaking, which is why we didn't do it. If you don't adopt a new vuln for an insta spell, you have a spell that nothing has immunity to.

Funky

[Deleted]

If the playerbase created the list of mobs needing adjustment, how much work would be left for the DM side to go in and edit them? If the playerbase gave you this list would you feel it would be worth making the adjustments to fix detonate?

[woqued]

It's fine if they respect the same immunity if you can just add vulnerability to Detonate to a few key mobs to make the spell more viable. Currently Detonate is mostly a "I wanna kill Loca Matriarch without trying" -spell, and faces similar issues as Wail against CoD - Disintegrate and CoD are lvl 6 spells and are universally more useful than their lvl 9 counterparts due to more flexible casting range and spell slot availability as you can use 6s, 7s, 8s or 9s to cast Disint/CoD - only 9s to cast Deto/Wail - and they are used to deal with the same targets except well, Detonate has issues with machines which is a fairly key Disint target so Deto is doing even worse - + kickback issues and touch and stuff and stuff, The spell is simply quite weak for a 9. A big appeal to Insta killing is that they are clean and surgical - they do only what they are meant to, no issues. If they don't work, np. Detonate is messy and awkward.

[FunkySwerve]

I would need a list of creatures that should be vuln to det and not disint. After that it would likely involve 3-4 hours work, since I'm rusty with letoscript, which is how we do that kind of mass editing. Likely I would simply add detonate immunity to everything with disint immune via a separate variable (which also gives us another variable to track in creature creation, the likely largest timesink involved here). Then it's a matter of removing it from the specified creatures. Kind of a major undertaking.

As to woqued's comment, I don't know if we can do that, since I'm at work and can't look at the implementation in the module.

Funky

[FunkySwerve]

If I were to release a list of spells that would be used by common mobs in Mechanus, would it help come up with gear suggestions balanced to be marginal increases / better for certain runs (such as Limbo, Mechanus).

Thanks,
Funky

[horbag]

i think it would, i know that befor i went to limbo for my first time i had to gather all sorts of pieces from abyss, abo and elly befor making a plunge into limbo, knowing what you might need to cover and then see what kind of items we have now would make it easyer to suggest items we would prefer to see in mechanus over the ones there currently are