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Post by chainlink on Nov 10, 2020 7:44:06 GMT
What bits of gear do you have to swap to be able to open stuff, does this adversely impact on your spellbook?
I've given up with opening stuff on my latest PM builds as I've found it too tedious and would rather just be able to search without having to reset spells everytime, other than that your build appears good.
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Post by starcore on Nov 10, 2020 7:53:43 GMT
My OL gear is:
+10 Belt (Tool Belt)
+15 Ammy (Glint)
+18 Armor (Pads)
+5 Mote (Toyshop)
+4 Gloves (Shop)
+2 Helm (Thieves hood)
That totals over 50, so no need to swap all of it, especially if a bard is around.
With dex that high, and potentially? taking ESF open lock, I could probably just swap the armor in most cases I think.
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Post by horbag on Nov 10, 2020 10:56:36 GMT
yea that is good gear to search/open lock but that is not good gear to use permanently my picker.searcher bard has to swap out his armour, amulet and belt every time to unlock chests, this is not a big porblem in hells, but in abyss it can be very difficult to lose all your spells to pick the loot so i am not sure how well this will work tbh, i think you might be underestimating the damage swapping gear on a toon can cause (spell wise mainly) and a PM does need spells to be usefull  |
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Post by chainlink on Nov 10, 2020 13:04:00 GMT
It is worse for non-spontaneous casters as you have to try an remember what you previously had in those slots rather than just getting your spells back when you rest. The pain can be lessened by keeping all the same spells in the slots near the end but still requires remembering to refill them before you rest or you'll end up with a load of blank slots. Helm and rings tend to be the only slots I don't lose spells by swapping out although the gear on your build may differ and if you are an optimiser who puts caster augmenters on as many random items as you can to maximise spells available per rest it will be annoying no matter what you swap out.
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Post by chainlink on Nov 10, 2020 15:01:25 GMT
I just noticed something why did you take ESF Div as you can get the required PWK effect boost from a GSF (or ESF if you are lucky enough to find a usable one) augment on an item plus use of SF draughts if required. My PM has had no issues just using the rather handy UR Wizard belt with GSF Div on it that I have. Now the conjuration epic is handy (no pun intended) and you could potentially go LSF Conjuration for useful Gate porting ability.
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Post by starcore on Nov 10, 2020 20:28:15 GMT
The way my spellbook is setup, I can get naked, re-equip gear, and !sb fill will get me back to normal, so its not toooooo bad.
I don't have a lot of draughts saved up, so ESF Div is pretty handy.
I also find the div epic is pretty useful, as I die occasionally. Probably less useful as I get better at the game.
If I had anything with an ESF div aug, then i'd drop it immediately.
Now that you mention it, and after a bit of thinking, I might actually drop it, and use an aug + draught
If I was going to drop div, i'd probably try and fit plate armor back in somehow, it's hard to understate how amazing the plate of anubis is for running all the pre-hells content. Hells and abyss i swap to silvermoon robe, but aoe FoD is truly awesome everywhere else.
One quick example... running thids, FoD is fast enough to kill the ectocloners before they spawn a shill 100% of the time. It also doesn't have a cap on the number of enemies it can kill in 1 cast like wail or cod.
It also does a good amount of neg damage, which a lot of LL stuff is vulnerable to.
Oh, also, meant to ask someone for a while now. Is gate port useful? I'm multiboxing 100% of the time, so hard to think of uses for it that I cant just port to party leader instead.
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Post by starcore on Nov 10, 2020 22:53:48 GMT
What are your thoughts on double splashing, both ranger (at 18) and rogue (at 20)?
Would the CL loss be much of a drawback?
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Post by starcore on Nov 10, 2020 23:39:14 GMT
yea that is good gear to search/open lock but that is not good gear to use permanently my picker.searcher bard has to swap out his armour, amulet and belt every time to unlock chests, this is not a big porblem in hells, but in abyss it can be very difficult to lose all your spells to pick the loot so i am not sure how well this will work tbh, i think you might be underestimating the damage swapping gear on a toon can cause (spell wise mainly) and a PM does need spells to be usefull Looks like i'd only need to swap the armor to pick... Skills:+63 Dex Bonus:+16 ESF:+10 Mote:+5 Song+21 Armor:+18 Total:133Aren't most locked chests after bosses anyway? I don't recall seeing too many mid run. (Although I haven't really been looking) As for searching, and traps, they're int based, so I'm not sure I'd even need to swap any slot gear. I think bard song is enough, maybe a +10 aug on a ring or something as well. Also, it's been suggested to me that one of the best pickers is a cleric, wouldn't they have the same problem with spells? |
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Post by chainlink on Nov 10, 2020 23:46:46 GMT
What are your thoughts on double splashing, both ranger (at 18) and rogue (at 20)? Would the CL loss be much of a drawback? Umm that would put you at four classes. |
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Post by starcore on Nov 10, 2020 23:53:47 GMT
You cant take more than 3? Didn't know that... damn... looks like no plate for me... probably ESF Conj then  |
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Post by simpetar on Nov 11, 2020 6:58:44 GMT
1. Your starting dex is a problem, it is 2 points too high. If your base dex is 25 or higher (you get there after 2x demi and first paragon point), your tumble / boneskin AC will get nerfed pretty hard. Drop it to 18 and put the points in con or wis.
2. Wail does not have HD cap on what it can kill. CoD does, but chances are you will not hit the cap, especially in LL content.
3. Div is far too good to give up ESF imo, more so than conj. Contingency is a get-out-of-jail free card and later on you will appreciate having powerful Assay Resistance even as PM. Plus having a cheap GSF aug on augmentable gear (which is stretched thin already) means, that you cannot aug it with something juicier like 888999 or such.
4. ESF in OL is an overkill, even the lowly SF will do. You can move that to pre-20 levels and kick out shield prof. Shield prof is not hard to get, for instance bur breach boots or Orb of Necessity from Styg, until you get your hands on pandect. Lo and behold, you just freed up an epic or LL feat. Such as EMA.
4.1. After you get couple demi iterations and/or +16 gear and/or paragon points, you will not be needing SF OL either.
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Post by horbag on Nov 11, 2020 8:42:09 GMT
yea that is good gear to search/open lock but that is not good gear to use permanently my picker.searcher bard has to swap out his armour, amulet and belt every time to unlock chests, this is not a big porblem in hells, but in abyss it can be very difficult to lose all your spells to pick the loot so i am not sure how well this will work tbh, i think you might be underestimating the damage swapping gear on a toon can cause (spell wise mainly) and a PM does need spells to be usefull Looks like i'd only need to swap the armor to pick... Skills:+63 Dex Bonus:+16 ESF:+10 Mote:+5 Song+21 Armor:+18 Total:133Aren't most locked chests after bosses anyway? I don't recall seeing too many mid run. (Although I haven't really been looking) As for searching, and traps, they're int based, so I'm not sure I'd even need to swap any slot gear. I think bard song is enough, maybe a +10 aug on a ring or something as well. Also, it's been suggested to me that one of the best pickers is a cleric, wouldn't they have the same problem with spells? in the abyss the chests appear after a mini on map 2, often we do not rest here, but chests can eather be picked or ignored ( i like the BUR loot) and yes eventually you will be able to search without any problem, but before a few layer penalty reductions and a good level you will have to swap gear. atm on my picker/bard, i just need to change my amulet and belt, need a GR for evereything above stygia ish i am not sayinbg at all that this is a bad build or anything, just might not be ideal to have a spell caster with usefull spells lose them for some loot (then again i do not have a PM so i do not know this gear you are talking about but if it is anything like my sorc it would hurt a lot ) |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 11, 2020 15:24:27 GMT
The reality is that the BUR chests aren’t worth opening and you’ll never have enough lock picks to sustain them all anyway. It’s more random BURs of which one in a blue moon may be a gold mine like any BUR could be. Supposedly they have extra chance for better randomization. I recently opened 75 BUR chests, over half were randomed down. And I got nothing amazing.
So, your priority for searching will be in Hell. At the end of the 2nd and 3rd maps. Your priority in lock picking will be Abyss Part 3 boss set loot chests (at the end of the run) and then consumable chests in any Limbo runs you might do. Anything else is extra.
Outside of that, the work and resources to open them for whah you get isn’t worth it in my opinion. Just something to consider to help you feel more Confident that you won’t be butchering yourself mid run for stuff.
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Post by starcore on Nov 11, 2020 20:31:59 GMT
1. Your starting dex is a problem, it is 2 points too high. If your base dex is 25 or higher (you get there after 2x demi and first paragon point), your tumble / boneskin AC will get nerfed pretty hard. Drop it to 18 and put the points in con or wis. I didn't think of that. That's super useful advise! Much appreciated! 2. Wail does not have HD cap on what it can kill. CoD does, but chances are you will not hit the cap, especially in LL content. I hit this cap ALL the time in thids. It makes a really big difference using empowered CoD over regular too. Wail works, but I find its just painfully slow to go off. Way too slow to get the ectocloners before they spawn shill's 3. Div is far too good to give up ESF imo, more so than conj. Contingency is a get-out-of-jail free card and later on you will appreciate having powerful Assay Resistance even as PM. Plus having a cheap GSF aug on augmentable gear (which is stretched thin already) means, that you cannot aug it with something juicier like 888999 or such. I actually really like Div, I use the epic super regularly (This is probably not a good thing!) It's even saved me a few wipes in onios. I was reluctant to drop it, but also respect chain's opinion pretty highly. I'm undecided again now. 4. ESF in OL is an overkill, even the lowly SF will do. You can move that to pre-20 levels and kick out shield prof. Shield prof is not hard to get, for instance bur breach boots or Orb of Necessity from Styg, until you get your hands on pandect. Lo and behold, you just freed up an epic or LL feat. Such as EMA Would ESF open lock not help with lockpicks? A few people have said that there aren't enough to open all the BUR chests you come across... would having ESF mean I could use a +12 instead of a +22 pick? (Again, I'm really sure how it works) Even if it didn't, it would save me switching out some gear, which I think might be worth it to not trash slots. I already have 2x demi, and I don't think there are any more OL bonuses from higher demi cycles (according to the wiki at least) |
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Post by starcore on Nov 11, 2020 20:44:05 GMT
i am not sayinbg at all that this is a bad build or anything, just might not be ideal to have a spell caster with usefull spells lose them for some loot (then again i do not have a PM so i do not know this gear you are talking about but if it is anything like my sorc it would hurt a lot ) For searching I only need +10 from gear, so shouldn't need to swap any slot gear. I believe there is an aug (Gopher?) with +10 search. So I can just put that on a ring. For lockpicking i'd need to swap chest only. That does have slots, but not a lot. |
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