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Post by Master Jaxx on May 28, 2006 17:01:01 GMT
Variety...I've made let's see....how many monks? 5, 6 + all dex based. *Yawn would like to make one that could actually do some damage...ah, amazing STR helps with that doesn't it? Well, yes it does shurlock...
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Post by lala on May 28, 2006 18:12:35 GMT
Variety...I've made let's see....how many monks? 5, 6 + all dex based. *Yawn would like to make one that could actually do some damage...ah, amazing STR helps with that doesn't it? Well, yes it does shurlock... And how many STR based Shadow dancers are done? How many Dex Barbarians??? You missed the point of my post. You want all the benefits of a class designed for dex and wis but turned into STR. Sorry if you disagree but certain classes are meant to be focused down a path. Let me know how many STR shadow dancers you see
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Post by Master Jaxx on May 28, 2006 20:50:58 GMT
Well, ya know the only reason why I think of a STR based Monk is just on account of the things I've seen on this server. I've been playing here since it started back in March 2004. During this time 2 STR Monk builds come to my mind. Adion the first lvl 40 on the server was an Mnk/RDD/Brd build...STR based as well as some char called Higan. Both were STR based Monks and at the time some of the more poweful chars made on the server. So is it so seemingly odd that some1 would make a STR based Monk? I can see why they made'em back then. Better AC than most classes and decent damage output. In fact in those days I remember hearing..."nothing good ever came of a dex based monk." I don't agree with that at all as I've spent much time playing DEX based monks. I've made many different monk builds with different focuses. Some on conceal and ac, others on ab or saves. So yes I'm mentioning it because I would like to have variety. You wouldn't see or at least it wouldn't be likely to see a STR based Shadowdancer or a DEX based Barbarian...so guess what I'm saying is I have seen some very effective Monk builds that were STR based. Also the point of bringing up something about STR based Monks is because an unarmed Monk is at a big disadvantage as far as damage goes esp if it's DEX based. Most of the DEX based Monks I've made have a very low STR in order to boost WIS and DEX. Cause as it is an unarmed Monk can't get GMW (adds to damage), keen or flame weapon. A reg monk without 4 lvls of a Tier 1 class (i.e. Barb, Ranger, Pally, Ftr) can get 5 reg attacks per round.. 1 more with Flurry of blows but with a -2 ab...X2 multiplier and a threat range of 19-20. This doesn't deal alot of damage compaired to lets say a Ftr with a Rapier (no wm lvls) 13-20 (with keen/improved crit) can do way more damage than the monk can with 5+ attacks per round. And compaired to other DEX classes with 4 Tier 1 lvls in the mix...the ac and conceal a monk gets just doesn't give a lot of incentive really as it is/cause the damage is in the gutter. Cause those builds can get 50 conceal and Epic Dodge and still use a Shield lol and do tons more damage. I wouldn't mind making a STR based Monk and have 1d20 + 33 or so per hit...some nice belts out there too these days for just a type (Hmmmm) Anywhoo we all got our ideas of what a good build is and so on...those are my reasonings behind making a little incentive to make STR based Monk... and not only that they are quite effective if made well enough.
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Post by FunkySwerve on May 28, 2006 22:19:29 GMT
Aye, rdd/monks used to be pretty pimpin, as were rdd/bard/cot builds. Not so much, anymore, but more crit immune critters in the hells will swing the balance a bit back towards monks damagewise. Funky
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Post by lala on May 28, 2006 23:14:28 GMT
Groo what you say about unarmed monks is spot on and they do suffer a lot when focusing on fists.
Maybe a secret item (monk glove) that requires 30 levels of monk to equip could be considered? This would help to balance out the biggest issue of monks; losing the use of support gauntlets as you need wpn based gloves when unarmed focus, and the facts you raised about them having substantial less dmg capability than traditional weapons.
Funky, any consideration in providing some additional benefits for taking the 10 Improved Spell Resist feats if/when legendary monk levels add SR? Or maybe increasing the empty body duration in a staggered fashion;such as 30 levels of monk x2, 40 levels is x3, 50 levels is x4 Sorry to mention it again but you might had missed the suggestions in an earlier post.
Thx Lala
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Post by FunkySwerve on May 29, 2006 2:35:41 GMT
I dont think any monk build with all 10 SR feats is really gonna be effective, even with 7 extra feats in LL, so their sr will be designed with that in mind. Best guess, around 80 at 60 without sr feats - thats 50 or 55% resist to a 60 mage. Funky
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Post by lala on May 29, 2006 9:28:04 GMT
Barbarian suggestion; Due to their toughness and resilience they gain regeneration at certain lvls. Barb lvl20 - Regen is 4 Barb Lvl25 - Regen is 8 Barb Lvl30 Regen is 12 Barb Lvl35 Regen is 16 Barb Lvl40 Regen is 20 Legendary levels do not apply, only barbarian levels up to 40. If this seems too strong maybe link it into Rage (if feasible).
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Post by Master Jaxx on May 31, 2006 16:58:06 GMT
I've done some looking into what determines Empty Body duration. From what I have read on the Bioware forums it's determined by amount of Monk levels. I agree that we shouldn't increase the concealment % but maybe if possible as a solution for LL scaling and such we could increase the duration at the same rate the duration increase pre- LL's. However, I have not been able to find/locate the exact info on how the progression works.
What could be done is: The amount of pre-LL lvls would determine the amount of concealment increase. Example: A lvl 30 Monk would get 60% per the 1% increase past 20th. A 40th lvl monk would be at 70%, so on and so forth. However, the duration of empty body would continue at the same rate, pre LL's.
Does any1 have any idea what the progression is? This is something I've thought about recently as I've made yet another monk...lol.
Just a few thoughts that have come to mind on this newest venture. Thanks for your time and efforts Funky.
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Post by Master Jaxx on May 31, 2006 19:24:53 GMT
Hmmm, core 3rd Edition says 1 round per lvl...sounds about right.
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Post by Parazia on Jun 3, 2006 1:50:02 GMT
I have noticed turn undead is very useless in the server and i was thinkin could u make it so it does divine damage or something? So that way there is a use for it.
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Post by FunkySwerve on Jun 3, 2006 5:08:07 GMT
Turn undead is on the todo list, but will not be particularly easy to fix. Funky
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Post by lala on Jun 3, 2006 22:39:47 GMT
From topic in wrong post;
I am posting this here as I dont want to flood the Change Ability topic with this subject - which has a lot of views from what I have seen
I assume Great Smitte was changed to bring both classes back to being closer to melee instead of capable 1 ability casters, with that said I am hoping these suggestions fit to balance the 2 classes for what feels a loss of power.
Why does it feel loss of power? Well before change smitte could be used 3 times per day before resting, so the dmg potential was very high for the cost of using Planar rings. However I can understand why a change has been done.
Suggestions 1. Divine MIght and Divine Shield gain additional dmg type based on the class; Positive for Paladin and Negative for Blackguard. As an example a 30 charisma Paladin would do 10 divine and 10 positive, while a Blackguard would do 10 divine and 10 negative. If it cant be split then either positive or negative for both classes.
2. Great Smitte duration tweak; with all the respective feats make it 1 use every 60 seconds BUT dying does not refresh the smitte. This would help balance out that the Paladin loses the 2 extra instant smites for what is a feat heavy process to get.
Well I hope the suggestions seem well balanced and acceptable to those that dont and also do play Paladin. Cheers Lala
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Post by sabregirl on Jun 7, 2006 3:58:50 GMT
Okay a couple more quick paladin suggestions. Could the paladin's Guardian Angel be made to remove the smite timer - i.e. essentially give one free smite on death? Wouldn't really be too susceptible to spam since guardian angel is a once per day deal.
Also Lay on of Hands makes a very nice attack against undead, but one use per day makes it considerably less useful. It would be nice if paladins with say a certain set of feats or number of palading levels could gain additional uses per day - maybe up to 3? Since it would seem like the trend is moving away from the all eggs in once basket great smite . .
-S
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Post by FunkySwerve on Jun 7, 2006 14:59:38 GMT
We will definitely be altering divine shield and might for LL. We will probably not be altering smite further, though the GA suggestion was interesting. Funky
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Post by lala on Jun 7, 2006 16:54:35 GMT
Suggestion for Bane Knight. Could it be considered to combine both sorc and blackguard levels when calculating great smite dmg. Otherwise the dmg is quite low when taking into account the 4 minute timer, and at least this Blackguard build can then benefit of a 40 level smite like paladin/cot builds that are done. Cheers Lala
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