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Post by tyranlthixis on Oct 27, 2006 19:26:41 GMT
I'm also getting the impression a lot of people are less than proud about who is in their group..... which makes me even more curious tell you the truth . Tyran
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Post by FunkySwerve on Oct 27, 2006 23:08:55 GMT
That was the closest someone has come to answering my question about why non-guilders would need to know guild affiliations, but I'm honestly still not sld on the idea of using up a scrye convo node on it. Eloquently put, at least. Funky
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Post by jctrapster on Oct 28, 2006 2:04:12 GMT
I heartily concurr with Tyran... it's a passive sort of resistance to a certain player type, with the concept of change as its ultimate goal. Call it a kind of server Darwinism, if you will. The good (willing to listen and learn, relatively polite) players will benefit due to the greater strength of veteran's (such as Tyranlthixis, who helped me get my epic spells for my druid, volunteering his time to essentially solo the area for me when he could have been farming) aid, while the others will stagnate. If someone is willing to give up their time, it would be nice to see that it's worth it. Not to mention the issue of accountability... a player might behave better with the possibility of someone speaking to their guild leader. And really, what harm does it do anyone to let others know who is in their guild? In all probability, nothing negative will happen to your toons as a result of this. When I party with someone like Churchy McFob or one of the various other McFobs, it makes me want to party with other members of that guild, which has identifaction about as open as it can be, because I know that to be in a guild with such knowledgeable veterans leading them, they must be worthy players. Just my 2 cents, and either way it's probably not going to affect much. Guess it really comes down to is it worth the work. -JC
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Post by whodat1 on Oct 28, 2006 3:16:00 GMT
- A guild list has minimal impact on problem users, the majority of problem users are not in any guild.
- What is far more common are problem cliques not using the HG guild system. I.e. The recent wnx incident. A list does nothing in this regard.
- Guild list will be used in a negative manner. Each person makes their own decision how they use the list, there is no control of the information.
- If people report problem users, like they already do, then the issue of a guild full of problem users would be addressed by the DMs. DMs would already be handling the issue, why do you need to?
- Guilds have a right to post a memberlist or to keep it private already. Guilds who want their online presence noted already do so (mcfobs, red wizards, eo, etc). So what does this do except force guilds to do something they have the option to already?
Now that I understand that this is really about "guild growth" and "friendship" instead of a tool to segregate, I'm surprised this is the only idea on the table. If I was looking to encourage guild growth, why I would recommend: - Guilds could be invited to be part of a collective, i.e. the "Higher Order" - each guild and resulting membership adhering to what everyone finds acceptable play and courtesy.
- A guild arena(s) could be automated to run with a token, allowing guilds to coordinate their own events and competitions w/o DM interaction.
- Guild DM incentives, i.e. loot % increase for all-guild parties, etc.
Having a list doesn't even come close to addressing guild growth and proper play that the options above do, and they don't harbor the negative potential of a guild list.
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Post by DragonChyld on Oct 28, 2006 3:20:22 GMT
Have to say that as a Guild Leader I am Damn proud of the people I have. Alot are like me and less than Hardcore players who spend every moment on the server. Some are vets.. And some are just damn cool. But I posted a full roster for my guild. If somebody is being an Ahole in my guild and there is proof I want to know about for the reason that Tyranlthixis stated. I do not wish to be associated with that kind of peeps.
An example. I have partied with BOTH Grudge and Miles. Liked them both alot, However knowing that they activly Party with God and allow him in thier guild makes me question my inital Judgment... Its things like this that I Believe makes peeps want to know who is in what guild. Blacklisting? No. Iwill gladly party with Both Miles and Grudge. However I Blacklisted God a LONG while ago. I have dropped party as soon as invited when I saw him in the group. That does not mean that I will not party with his guildmates.. BUT I do appricate the insite as to what company they keep.
Just on a further note, I have been talking on my guild boards about the very thing you just posted Whodat. Keep an eye out for my ideas. ~ DC
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Post by Grudge on Oct 28, 2006 3:25:45 GMT
What i think some people here may be overlooking, is that not all guilds are about recruiting as many players as possible. Take my guild for example. We are more just a group of friends that know eachothers strenghts and weaknesses as well as our own, and we play off eachother. As far as reqruting newbs, if theres a certain person we seem to be finding in our parties quite often, we simply offer them an invitation to our guild. No advertising. No initiation rites. Just a bunch of people who know eachother really well.
~grudge
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Post by tyranlthixis on Oct 28, 2006 22:54:22 GMT
I think the "negatives" are being overplayed/overstated. For a very long time it was possible to see who was in what guild via the scry playerlist. During that time there was far more competition for runs because 1.) gameworld was a lot smaller 2.)there were only one or two servers 3.)They didn't have tag only areas such as the Illthid to control player progression into LL areas. If there ever was a time these negatives would have shown up, it was then. But, nothing really came of having that information. People are worrying about nothing. I think people need to look at the big picture a little more closely.
Lately, I have been hearing a lot of shouts... things like "are guilds active on this server?". Basically the playerbase is alienated from the guild system as it stands. If your a private member guild you may not care, but it hurts the guild system in general and like I said before promotes an atmosphere of confusion.
Tyran
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Post by bhao on Oct 29, 2006 0:02:16 GMT
not being in a guild at all, i thought i'd add my unqualified opinion to this. - A guild list has minimal impact on problem users, the majority of problem users are not in any guild.
- What is far more common are problem cliques not using the HG guild system. I.e. The recent wnx incident. A list does nothing in this regard.
this is not an arguement against a public list. this just shows, that it would not solve all the problems. you can't possibly know, whether if it will be used in a negative manner, and the whole idea, that (this) information needs to be controlled seems wrong somehow. it seems to me, that the idea of guilds itself is to segregate. a list would just make it more obvious. that would penalize people for not being in a guild. maybe some people don't want to be in one. if a public list really is a problem, then people in guilds should not have one either. i can see no reason why a part of the players should not be allowed to know this information, because that would segregate them.
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Post by whodat1 on Oct 29, 2006 6:38:43 GMT
I don't see the big picture because you don't know of any issues in the past? How would you know if that list was used to blacklist people? Because it didn't happen to you?If all this thread is about is helping the guild system, and guild members are telling you they have concerns about the guild list, whats the point of pushing this argument to 4 pages? Your not a guild member currently, you have the luxury to benefit from your suggestion, and leave the guilds to suffer potential consequences. If its about the guilds and not about you then this is not making sense to me at this point.
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