Would be useful to have a !storedontchangemyflaminconfig command for holding items like labeled rings, etc.
One quick question.. when you target a box to pickup and store, would be useful if you could put it back into a box. Like, all my rings are stored in a box. When I move characters, I'd like to get them all back into the box automatically.
What kind of 'config' are you referring to?
And yes, there would be a bulk retrieve as well as a bulk store.
Sorry, shoulda explained. I mean things like color/design/label/etc.
I really think this will be way to hard to use, even though I guess it wont take too much time ot get used to it, lots of ppl will be avoiding it a bit. I, speaking for myself only, would be happier without randomized loot and the bankchests than with randomized loot without bankchest. (I may change my opinion once everything is done, though )
Also, will be options to retrieve all items from a bankchest at the same time? or a command that once used, can store all items target by you without typing the !store command again?
I ask this, most because of my scrolls chests, that took so much time to make my wizards reincarnations easier, and now it seems it will be even harder to reincarnate them if I dont get a especial item from abo
Anyway, I thought that the server moving would be a bad thing, but it only made my life better. So, I'll be trusting your programming special powers, and believing this will be a really good improvement for HG.
You said 10 items to a chest max? hmmm... What about load them 10 at a time, then unload them before opening the next page? Longer browsing times, but at least us visually oriented people can still be comfortable with it. I'll get used to it either way, but I prefer the chests... I guess it's what you're accustomed to.
I think most of the regular players will eventually get used to this new system, but I believe it will tend to alienate newcomers to the server.
I've been playing for a couple of years off and on, and recently convinced my brother to join. I have written books of info through email, explaining to him how to use the bankchests, the useful simtool commands, explaining the tag system, the level caps, the way stacking bonuses work, etc etc. This mod goes so far beyond NWN that it really is a new game.
I have yet to see a change/enhancement made that made me think "well THAT was a step backwards", and I doubt this change will be, either, but it is going to be fairly complicated to explain to a casual NWN player, I think.
And I really think the more you move away from the visuals, the less immersive the overall game experience will become. (To exaggerate), perhaps we'll eventually be able to play HG entirely within a google spreadsheet document! The mechanics will love it, but the casual gamers will probably pass.
Post by drunkenboaster on Jun 4, 2009 15:30:50 GMT
There was mention of a search type function for item properties. Could level required or evan better a range of levels able to use be included in the search portion? A majority of my current chests have level requirement in part of the names for ease of finding gear for lowby toons, I hope there will be a way to continue to make it easy to find for example ammulets for the level 10-15 toon to use.
Post by supertrooper33 on Jun 4, 2009 16:26:02 GMT
What about a separate bankchest for the randomized loot, and keeping the normal ones for the regular stuff? This new chest could load them 10 at a time, as needed, while the others stick with their current 50 config. Have to agree with dirk that switching wholy to the new way would alienate tons of people, and instead I think you would have lots of people turning to bank toons rather than work through it.
Oh, another thing, if several people have a !buy order outstanding, who gets it first? If it's by first-come-first-serve, one very rich person could essentially prevent everyone else from getting an item by ordering a huge amount of them (or refreshing the buy order if a measure isn't put in place to stop that). I guess this is a privilege of the rich.
If somebody is willing to by an SoS for 5 gold, and someone else for 10 gold, and someone puts one on the market for 1 gold, then who gets it? The 10 gold person wouldn't mind losing 6 gold for it, should the price automatically rise to accommodate that? If not, should the 10 gold person get the item since they were willing to pay more, even though both were able to afford it? If yes, then it'd make it really hard for those without huge amounts of cash to get any use out of the market, but I guess that's the privilege of the wealthy (again).
The person who placed their order first, and you'd get 1 gold for it.
I'd suggest price and time priority rather than just time priority. To make a market efficient you want to give the trade to the person with the BEST price not just the soonest price. You want to encourage price discovery via bidding and offering accurately and ignoring price priority is a step back from this. Most electronic exchanges use a method of price/time priority in matching trades.
The more interesting question, however, is if someone shows a bid of 10 in the book, and somone comes into the book with an offer of 5, do you trade the item at 10, at 5, or at somewhere between the two. There are different methodologies for this that are common in markets.
As to the entire new system in general - I share most of the concerns we've seen so far. I am worried that you'll end up with a vastly more powerful system that is a clunker to use and has an overly large barrier of entry. This is a tool you want everyone to use, not just specialists.
Perhaps, instead of randomizing items - tehycould come with a randomization augment with +- properties on it. You would definately be giving up the sheer quantity of item diversity, but a large set of "randomization augments" would allow you to only have to store one extra piece of info per item in the chest - namely the augment. Cut the chest down to 25 items with augments and it should be similiar? Definately a chunk of work to build varied and quality augments in order to synthesize a reasonable randomness, but perhaps viable? Unfortunately, this would be a large divergance from the currently proposed item randomization.
Post by MurphysLawAgain on Jun 5, 2009 19:41:12 GMT
I accept that I know nothing about the underlying stress that amending the bank database to include randomisation and auguments will put on the servers. This said I have tried to lay out a few thoughts about the current system below to see if it leads anywhere useful.
Key Features of the current design
Players deposit and recover unlimited amounts of loot in a way thats tied to CD key rather than character name
Many users can access their own bank at the same time
Keep categories of loot together (50 items per category).
Players can develop their own way of managing their gear ( everyone can name their own chests).
“By eye" hunting for items. This is especially useful for gear whose name is not obvious. An example of this might be "nameless cold" .. the BUR light armour. If you weren't sure then it could be a bunch of different things.
Its easy to rapidly drop off a number of items and pick up items fast. An example is my chest of hellrings & hellgear which I can hoover up in moments to join a run.
Areas to improve in the current approach
Custom names and crafting are lost when gear is put into a bankchest (although with crafting this may not be all bad)
We cannot order the loot by its name when we open a given chest. This would really help with scrolls & rings. This feature is more for the vets who know 95% of the items by name and every wizard who is obsessive about getting their scroll list in order (yes that included me for a long while).
Personal bankchests which are just a way to confuse yourself in the bank and lose stuff during reincarnation.
Things the new system could do to help matters
Maintain the current capacity to categorise loot into groups that make sense to each player. Even if its a text system naming categories would make it easier to sort and arrange items.
Allow tagging items so that players could do a command like “!bank roguegear” to get their characters gearset back in one action. An alternative version would be to automate dropping gear off (!bank repeat deposit) which could set the command targetter to allow rapid deposit of gear that would be useful. A reverse process would also help. Repeat typing (!bank deposit) to drop off 25 rings, amulets and consumables each time would be an unwelcome waste of time.
Have some way to sort by eye. One way would be colour coded text perhaps? Or a shop style dialogue and merchant system (although from memory they consume resources very fast).
If the new system would work alphabetically, then vets at least would be able to find most of their stuff. Any dialogue or text based system will need to offer categories and some clue as to which item is which.
Perhaps there could be a bank server (111?) which had less module areas but was devoted to processing bank requests? This could tie in with the shop dialogue approach.
Any progress on this? I'm still of the opinion that we're going to need some way to visually browse items in a 'bankchest' format.
Would it be possible to load a bankchest with, instead of "complete" items, simply load the chest with "dummy" items that retain the appearance of the items they represent, but not the stats (instead, for non-commodities, the item description says "type '!show #xxxx' for details on this item")? Or would this still be too laggy?