amoi
Neophyte
Posts: 15
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Post by amoi on Jul 20, 2012 5:34:13 GMT
Requires 10 monk levels and 10 pale master levels before level 30.
Upon becoming a Vampire, Characters will gain the following: Critical Hit immunity. Vampiric regeneration for unnarmed attacks = to Vampire level/4, including legendary levels. Domination - Exactly the same as the Cleric Evocation Epic: Conversion. Useable once per day.
Stunning Fist: PM & monk levels count as Vampire levels(and vampire levels count as monk levels.) toward Stunning Fist DCs. Stunning Fist is a swift action. Stunning fist is granted unlimited uses per day(I think this should be done for all monks, regardless). Stunning Fist still respects Critical Hit Immunity and is a Will save.
Quivering Palm: PM & Monk levels count as Vampire levels toward Quivering Palm DCs. Quivering Palm is a swift action. Quivering Palm, is granted uses per day = to Vampire level/4, including legendary levels(this probably also needs to happen for all monks). Quivering Palm respects Critical Hit Immunity and is a Fort save.
Undead Graft: Is significantly enhanced. The DCs are calculated the same way as Stunning Fist & Quivering Palm. It can be used unlimited times per day. It is a swift action. Undead Graft respects Fear Immunity and is a Will save. A successful attack paralyzes the opponent for 1d6 +2 rounds.
Deathless Master Touch: DCs are calculated the same way as Stunning Fist, Quivering Palm, and Undead Graft. Deathless Master Touch is granted uses per day = to Vampire level/4, including legendary levels. Deathless Master Touch respects Death Immunity and is a Fort save.
Vampire spells: Normal PM spell rules apply.
What do you all think?
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Post by pete on Jul 20, 2012 20:17:47 GMT
i like the idea of combining monk and PM, the touch attacks match quite well, this also seems nicely balanced due to the loss of monk defensive abilities but the gain of PM AC bonus.
some things that strike me are the lack of specific feats, as most quasi's have such requirements, perhaps GWF unarmed and great fort?
personaly id add a quest as part of the requirements such as you have to be killed and fuge in Castle Gaobin before level 31 (where you get turned)
one thing to consider is you need arcane caster levels to take PM (5 wiz or 6 sorc), so the builds AB will suffer as a result (you will be forced to take at least 6 pre epic levels in a 1/2 AB class [5 wizard + 10 PM + 10 monk by lvl 29 leaves 4 pre epic levels to choose]), might want to give it a bonus to AB for 2-3 minutes after it has "fed" (successfully landed vampiric touch spell - this would create a need for lvl 3 spots, but as pale master requires the ability to cast lvl 3 spells this should not be a problem), you can use bard levels to qualify for PM but you wouldnt get the vampiric touch spell, to me it seems this is nicely balanced as a bard one would have higher AB anyway so wouldnt need this boost as much
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Post by Yojimbo on Jul 20, 2012 20:48:12 GMT
To me the problem is that such a combo limits the build options you will have to be a Monk/PM/(Bard, Wizard, Sorcerer) and if spells matter Wizard is probably the best choice since you can learn with only 1 level but if spells don't Bard may be the best as it has 3/4 BAB vs 1/2. You would need either 5 Wizard, 6 Sorcerer, or 7 Bard.
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amoi
Neophyte
Posts: 15
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Post by amoi on Jul 20, 2012 22:18:51 GMT
To me the problem is that such a combo limits the build options you will have to be a Monk/PM/(Bard, Wizard, Sorcerer) and if spells matter Wizard is probably the best choice since you can learn with only 1 level but if spells don't Bard may be the best as it has 3/4 BAB vs 1/2. You would need either 5 Wizard, 6 Sorcerer, or 7 Bard. Yep, you only get 3 classes, and this quasi requires all 3 of them. There's still some interesting decisions to make about which class to have as your CC. Wizard actually wouldn't be a bad choice for some of the buffs. |
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Post by kingcamaro on Jul 20, 2012 23:42:13 GMT
i think somewhere along the lines, the darkness spell should come into play. being a vampire and all, the sun aint good right? so maybe something like while out in the sun, you get a penalty, and while in darkness/indoors, you get a bonus. i dont know whats possible with the engine in NWN, but increased/decreased AB would be cool, or bonus regen/DoT depending weather its night/darkness or day come to mind.
increased/decreased phys immunity (kinda like elysium, casting darkness hurts them more ^^)
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Post by Michael Buble on Jul 21, 2012 11:04:35 GMT
you could trigger the AB like the Ranger's perk that gets bonus stats while fighting outside just the opposite for a vampire. It should have a once per rest bite attack to be true in roleplay that does something.
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Post by Michael Buble on Jul 21, 2012 11:13:25 GMT
Also since they traditionally, well according to the movies, have issues with running water I wonder if they should have an increased chance to be Amni'd when crossing moving water.
Perhaps a polymorph into a gaseous form (best I could suggest is an air elemental form) that gives them like a GS for the time frame of a GS pot usable once per rest to flee like a vampire.
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Post by arek on Jul 21, 2012 14:23:25 GMT
You would need either 5 Wizard, 6 Sorcerer, or 7 Bard. Actually, you only need 3 levels in any of these classes. PM doesn't require the ability to cast 3rd-level arcane spells, it requires 3 levels in an arcane spellcasting class. Check it in the chamber if ya don't believe me. :-) --Arek |
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amoi
Neophyte
Posts: 15
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Post by amoi on Jul 21, 2012 18:54:50 GMT
There's certainly a lot of room for other quasi class features here, particularly customized spells. I like some of the ideas I'm seeing here. Others, I think might be prohibitively difficult to code, but I don't really know.
One idea I had was to make Vampires have a special Magic Circle Against Alignment that would become a sort of ghetto curse song or battletide, lowering saves and ac/ab of enemies inside the circle.
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Post by tomaan on Jul 22, 2012 18:15:28 GMT
Not a bad idea -- tried to build one once but couldn't get it to work.
Spells would be pretty much nerfed, so how about giving them Negative Energy Ray/Burst and increase the damage to 20-25d12 neg/20-25d12 vile?
Maybe also add PM levels to empty body calculations -- seems like a vampire should have some innate concealment. Same for unarmed bonus damage (it would still max out below pure monk due to caster levels).
Another possibilty would be to give unarmed attacks a "bleed"/poison or some other debilitating value with XX monk (or XX pm) levels.
Lastly -- with so many non-1/1 ab classes, AB and attacks/rd would be limited. Maybe give them a version of Tensors that grants a bonus to BAB and an extra attack (or two) per round for a short duration? Could also tie to monk levels for versions that go more melee than caster.
In terms of balance, they should probably be at least -10% vulnerable to positive damage (maybe as high -25%).
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 22, 2012 21:02:11 GMT
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amoi
Neophyte
Posts: 15
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Post by amoi on Jul 24, 2012 3:48:47 GMT
Some very very impressive work went into that thread you posted. I do have one criticism, though. Blackguards already have 2 quasi classes, 3 if you count a turner as a quasi class(which, it sort of is.) But really, great work in that thread by all the contributors. I did not work NEARLY that hard on this idea. I could, if the Devs asked me to. I wanted to gauge interest in this idea before putting that much work into it. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 26, 2012 22:13:30 GMT
Some very very impressive work went into that thread you posted. I do have one criticism, though. Blackguards already have 2 quasi classes, 3 if you count a turner as a quasi class(which, it sort of is.) But really, great work in that thread by all the contributors. I did not work NEARLY that hard on this idea. I could, if the Devs asked me to. I wanted to gauge interest in this idea before putting that much work into it. I think the interest is there. I just think people other than me could do a better job at fleshing it out. The devs won't ask you to work on a class like this. The way things work is you hash out and build a good class and the devs take it into consideration. As development seems a bit slow right now, I wouldn't count on this or any new quasis being added any time soon : ( |
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