Bane Knight Tweak

[tomaan]

since we're talking about tweaks....

...change Bane Knight spell penetration bonus to STR mod/2 OR (BG level + Sor level)/4

As it currently stands, you can get up to +16 spell pen on feats alone....a Bane Knight would need a str of 148 to get a comparable bonus. Changing the bonus to STR mod/2 reduces that down to 74 -- doable with XR, x2 demi and paragon levels, but not an easy target to hit. If it was based on BG/SOR level, it would cap at +15 for a pure Bane Knight....neither of which are OP imho.

Why make this change? Because Bane Knight offensive spells are basically worthless - it's not worth the commitment in a feat-tight build to get access to such a limited spellbook. You're better served creating a self-buffing tank, which you can do just as effectively (if not better) with Ranger.

Even with this update, BGs would still need to either read a spell focus book or take the feats (or both) to maximize the effectiveness of either their offensive and defensive spells - just as they do now. This update simply makes the offensive ones a viable option.

[simpetar]

Apr 22, 2020 17:14:18 GMT tomaan said:

As it currently stands, you can get up to +16 spell pen on feats alone

No, you get +10 with PSP

....a Bane Knight would need a str of 148 to get a comparable bonus.

You would need 90 str / +40 modifier to match pure caster with PSP, which is still not possible with current XRs, but far from the number you are suggesting.

Changing the bonus to STR mod/2 reduces that down to 74 -- doable with XR, x2 demi and paragon levels, but not an easy target to hit. If it was based on BG/SOR level, it would cap at +15 for a pure Bane Knight....neither of which are OP imho.

If the original premise was correct, that would not be OP, but +16 way above what a dedicated caster gets from feats.

If you want more realistic numbers to put BKs in line with pure casters, consider something like 2/7 * str mod. This number may look strange, but the practical applications are not:

52 str (i.e. 40 base +12 from items, the point where you get crit immunity) yields +6 SP, as per ESP
60 str yields +7 SP
66 str yields +8 SP, as per LSP; this can be reached with moderate ease and some investment in great strength feats
74 str yields +9 SP
80 str yields +10 SP, as per PSP; this is possible with current races, but you need to invest heavily into str at the expense of other stats/feats, str artefact, and use of all available bonuses (x2 demi, and PLs)

[desocupado]

Spell DCs for certain spells (those listed below) are equal to 10 + spell level + (STR modifier x 9/10)
BKs now get a bonus to spell penetration of strength modifier/4. This bonus does not stack with spell penetration feats.

Caster levels for those same spells are equal to Sorcerer level + Blackguard level.

So to get +10 spell penetration one needs +40 Str modifier (base 90).

I propose a much simpler:

BKs now get a bonus to spell penetration of BK level /6. This bonus does not stack with spell penetration feats.

No need to over complicate their SP scaling. They would slightly faster than a regular caster at Legendary Levels and both would even out during Paragon Levels.
I wouldn't think that if they had even better SP it would be an issue, given that their DC is lower.