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Post by FormerAdmin on Sept 9, 2004 6:51:11 GMT
Yup, it's official: Time has come to a stand still in Ascension. It is perpetually "Month 7, Day 5, Hour 5", and I think it is causing some major lag issues with the MOD. Forsaken: can you look into the scripts and see if you can see what the problem is? Because it is pretty bizarre that time has just completely stopped altogether. I mean, even the sky doesn't change, it is always dawn.
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Post by PapaSmurf on Sept 9, 2004 12:16:54 GMT
Rastan posted something about clerics being added to the uselss classes. such as rouge, barbarian, and some others. I think this is BS, ive made a pretty good pure barbarian with 3 lvls of fighter who is badass (PapaSmurf) and I messed up on some things in the build as well as a pretty good rouge/shadow dancer who is not complete but one of my favorite characters to play when i do play you might of heard of him, his name is Hack ;D Anyways I dont think the rouge or barbarian are useless nor are some of the others on your list, I know rip made a kickass blackgaurd palemaster. I'll agree that shadowdancer is a somewhat useless class, well at least beyond 1st lvl. But thats biowares fault thy dont get any good abilites past hide in plain sight. the shadow daze is ok but even normal non-HG monsters save against it most of the time. and the summoned shadow is just pathetic even if your fighting goblins. A way to make the shadow dancer better would be to give it an ability to hide from true seeing at epic lvls.
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Post by PapaSmurf on Sept 9, 2004 12:37:58 GMT
I agree that every enemy should have some kind of weakness, and form my expereince, I havent played hg in a while... all the monsters do. Ive yet to find a monster on HG that is impossible to defeat with a well balanced party. I'm not a fighter complaing that clerics shouldnt be able top mod the floor with undead ruin after using heal or mass heal. Ive played on this server for a while, and have made a character of every class except a druid or harper scout. When I first started on this server paladins and clerics were some of the best characters out there since the mod was about 80% undead! rouges sucked ass since they couldnt sneak attack %$@! Now they have balanced it out a lot! There is a good varitiy of monsters with varying weaknesses. I just cant see how a cleric can have trouble fighting undead, maybe they have changed things in the last 2 weeks or so i'm not sure. But with all the buffs clerics can get, plus divine might and divine shield feats which can add a lot if you have a high charisma to ab, ac, and damage they can deal out a ton of damage. I agree they need to make some better blunt weapons and undead shouldnt be immune to blunt or have a high resistance against it. The reason undead have a high resistance against slash and peirce is because they have no organs nor do they bleed, so they must be bashed And the divine favor spell is awesome!! It makes your attack bonus the same as a fighter of the same lvl so around 20th lvl thats a +5 to your attack bonus, and with divine might, aid, bless, and prayer and probbly some others im forgeting it makes a cleric almost never miss.
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Post by Azhei on Sept 9, 2004 12:50:48 GMT
[quote author=Blood link=board=BugReport&thread=1079072279&start=231#15 date=1094601280 using mass heal in the tower and "powerleveling"[/quote]
heheh Dworkin just reminded me that that was her fault she had some friends that where two levels two low under the 4 level range and bumped them up in the tower and some newb walked in on her. Also she used to be the only source of mass heals in the game. She's cooking up something else but she won't tell me the details. Something about turning into a mobile vendor for potions and stuff you cant buy in stores. i know her pale master has every spell 4th level and below in her book. Hoorah for dynamic economies.
Oh and check the script for spellcaster boost the clock stop seems to have started at about the same time.
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Post by Azhei on Sept 9, 2004 17:04:25 GMT
Rastan posted something about clerics being added to the uselss classes. such as rouge, barbarian, and some others. I think this is BS, ive made a pretty good pure barbarian with 3 lvls of fighter who is badass (PapaSmurf) and I messed up on some things in the build as well as a pretty good rouge/shadow dancer who is not complete but one of my favorite characters to play when i do play you might of heard of him, his name is Hack ;D Anyways I dont think the rouge or barbarian are useless nor are some of the others on your list, I know rip made a kickass blackgaurd palemaster. I'll agree that shadowdancer is a somewhat useless class, well at least beyond 1st lvl. But thats biowares fault thy dont get any good abilites past hide in plain sight. the shadow daze is ok but even normal non-HG monsters save against it most of the time. and the summoned shadow is just pathetic even if your fighting goblins. A way to make the shadow dancer better would be to give it an ability to hide from true seeing at epic lvls. We are talking about the classes not munchkiny instances of dipping. the basic premise is that a "full" palemater 5/30/5 or 10/30 is useless or a level 40 barbarian is relativly useless same thing with clerics sorcs and wizards. The rest of the classes who are all about melee are gleefully and tirelessly hacking away all day long with these uber artifacts with point bits. while the full casters are left behind in the dust. And Rogues are pretty useless since pretty much no npc can be pp'ed most of the important ones are immune to sneak attacks, criticals, 50% of whatever damage type you care to name. The shadowdancer wouldn't be usefull if they would stop using true seeing as a substitute for darkvision THAT is is a problem. ultravision and see invis is fine but rue seeing makes it so you cant hide and thats not even in line with the way hide works. Its an anti illusion vision not x-ray vision.
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Post by Higan on Sept 9, 2004 19:38:21 GMT
the clock problem probably has to do with the # of minutes (real time) that equals 1 (game) hour is set at some high number, though what do i know
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Post by Higan on Sept 9, 2004 19:44:56 GMT
also, by no means is any class worthless (cept harper scout), its just that some of their abilites arn't as useful in epic lvs as a different class, such as a barbarians rage, it gives +4 or so to str but good armor gives str bonus so the bonus dosn't really do much, but a barbarian still has other abilities that are useful. besides, the difference isn't really that much
and who care if a certain class is a bit worse than others, if you like it, make it anyways, their will always be someone that has a better build and can easily kill you (myself included)
there, i've given opinion... though why do people ask "a pennie for your thoughts" for your two cents worth?
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Post by Blood on Sept 10, 2004 2:17:01 GMT
hehe i guess your right Azhei, i am showing my D&D age, i'm only 26 but have played D&D since it was just D&D, not AD&D ok all i really wanted out of this forum was to know WHY i find undead that have MORE bludgeoning resist than anything else. That's all i want to know I only mentioned the reference to show that in 2nd edition, undead could ONLY be damaged properly by BLUNT weapons. Thats the only reason i included it.
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Post by Slayers Ghost on Sept 10, 2004 2:31:18 GMT
hehe i guess your right Azhei, i am showing my D&D age, i'm only 26 but have played D&D since it was just D&D, not AD&D ok all i really wanted out of this forum was to know WHY i find undead that have MORE bludgeoning resist than anything else. That's all i want to know I only mentioned the reference to show that in 2nd edition, undead could ONLY be damaged properly by BLUNT weapons. Thats the only reason i included it. Do you mean EVERY SINGLE undead in the game? Or some in particular? Surely not EVERY undead is succeptable to bludgeoning. Any MM will tell you that skeletons are vulnerable to bludgeoning. However, anything with flesh still hanging from its bones is not. Check out zombies, wraiths, vampires, ghouls, ghosts, shadows, mummies, bodaks.......... Which undead do you mean? Can you not turn them? Cast Sunbeam or Undeath to Death on them? Can you not use every other means in a clerics arsenal on them at your disposal that irradicate undead? Or is that fact that SOME undead are resistant to bludgeoning so unnerving that it gnaws at your very being, like a cancerous growth waiting to consume your whole existence?
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Post by Slayers Ghost on Sept 10, 2004 2:49:17 GMT
how about some old fashioned cleric only maces o disruption. Divine power can only carry someone so far occationally you just have to reach out and smash something ;D. Oh and papasmurf its not that people complain about a tough server the problem is when it becomes worthless to take a specific class because thier key abilities (like a clerics undead smityness) becomes minimalized. It would be similar if all of the sudden some monsters popped up that where immune to weapons and could only be damaged by spells and such. the mass riot that ensued would be amusing to say the least. Rastan, is it true that you can replace a cleric with rings and such? if so i am sad my god has frowned upon me ...... heh, blood if you think clerics have the shaft try playing a straight up bard ... you have to take 15 levels of pale master just to be able to get epic spells.... of course the whole immunity to crits really helps your poor bard run away Bottom Line. On a power-gaming mod - Bards: suck Pale Masters: suck Harpers: suck Shadowdancers: suck Clerics: suck when the mons use dispel magic You want to use the above classes effectively? Go to a role-playing server. You'll be able to be a fisherman or bee-keeper and craft your little heart out all day long too. Want to build a badass character? Log into HG PoA and use a real build. You find a way to use the above classes to make a powerful character, be sure to post it here. Until then, quit pissing on Rip's leg and telling him it's raining. They suck. You know it. The builders know it. There are no apologies.
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Post by Higan on Sept 10, 2004 19:16:24 GMT
fyi, hg is a munchkin server, its made so people can explore around, find sharp blades and then cut the monsters into thousands of pieces, also, it is not entirely based on weapons, i'm pretty sure if someone makes a build porely, lets say a wisdom based half-orc wizard, then they would really suck
and on any server or in dnd (cept for monks and possibly mages) everyone would die in a second without equipment, *you punch the enimie, it takes 2 points of damage*, not too effective against anything, you would probably get beaten-up by a blind, druken, armless kobold
if you think theres somethings that need editing, then download the poa mod and try making some stuff, you will find out that it takes lots of time even for a single area, and theres easily over 50 areas made by the hg dms
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Post by PapaSmurf on Sept 10, 2004 19:28:05 GMT
I dont think you can say no one is building power characters. (For clarifacation, my defintion of a powergaming server or character is a heavy combat based mod. and heavy combat oriented character.) All the chracters I try to build are power characters, and your right in a paper and pencil game they would not be as good because they have no social skills at all. Nor do they have decent saves, but with items in HG most saves are useless other than reflex because of all the immunites that are available. HG is heavy influenced by items, but like higan said if you build a crpayy character with good items he still ownt be as good as a good character with good items.
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Post by Azhrei on Sept 10, 2004 19:31:00 GMT
First off no one would make a half orc wisdom based orc, a wisdom based half orc cleric or druid yes.
Higan you appear to not understand the point. It s the reliance on items that are in and of themselves powerful enough to make the individuals classes a moot point except for qualification to use it that makes a server munchkiny not powerful items in and of themselves.
And running around hacking things with swords into pieces isn't the problem, its when that becomes the only viable option.
Been there done there on the editing, Its not the production of new things thats the problem its how wickedly unbalenced the new stuff can be.
Balance is key to making a server worth playing without all you can hope for is new people signing on for the novelty of the newness and then quitting as they are forced more and more into a specific role. Without any attempts at balance all you can hope for is a mediocre server, instead of the great server that the mod has the potential to become.
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Post by Rastan on Sept 10, 2004 19:49:31 GMT
perhaps i was too blunt by saying that most clases aree worthless, what I meant to say was "easily replaced by items or lack of"
Melee based builds seem to have the most uses -weapon finesse gives extremely high AC while still allow for lots of attack bonus -Dev. critical. One of my builds back in the day was a dual kurki weapon master who had 45 str, 55 attack bonus, 7 attacks a round, and 55% chance of a critical hit. needless to say I quickly slaughtered everything that didnt have critical immune
Other build styles such as rogue/Arcane archer ranged weapon base seem to often cost too much for a character to keep. In order to get decent arrows they either need to know an epic ranger(seeker arrows once every reset) or an great thief(withering arrow: 2 sets a reset). both are quite difficult to gain an endless supply of so most archers are stuck with weak lvl 25 arrows
mages/sages: once reaching epic levels these spellcasters no longer gain spell slots for level gains, most decent spells (mass heal, IGMS, BBOD) are placed into items on the server, so non spellcasters can enjoy the benefits of spellcasters without sacrificing HP or Attack.
Rogue/Assassin/Blackguard of sneak attack is useless in later levels because most epic enemies have either sneak or critical immune
The classic support character "Shifter" has even had an item replace thier medusa/basilisk stoning ability.
barbarian rage is worthless later on since the equipment already gives the stat bonuses andthe will saves is pointless do to mind immune. all that is left is the -2 AC which makes for a terrible ability
rogue is only needed for the lvl40 level since they are only choosen for their skills, And barbarian is a poor choice when compaired to a fighter
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Post by Higan on Sept 10, 2004 19:50:48 GMT
i understand what you mean, but i don't think people would be content with it staying the same power lv, the dms have to constantly make areas harder and harder to give people more of a thrill cause they are already bored with the easier ones, but once the area is made it being too hard new and more powerful items have to come out, this would work well, cept the bones on the items only go so high and the max lv is 40
also, the dms work a ot on the server so they don't have much time to go around to check each item to see if each race and class has equaly strong stuff, so people take rouge and or the certain class so that way they actualy stand a chance
and as you said, running around and killing stuff should not be the only thing to do, unfortuantly it currently is, but i'm sure that it will get better, the dms probably start on that cause its the simplest thing to do, if you've taken a look at whats gonna be put into bywater you would see lots of new things being added
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