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Post by starcore on Jan 8, 2021 3:20:42 GMT
Hi, Does anyone know how the staff forsaken sorcery CC shenanigans interacts with reincarnation? I'm looking to reinc my PM (1Rog/9Wiz/70PM) into a sorc based PM... The ideal build would be 20Sorc/60PM, but I'm not sure if I take 20 sorc, then would be the CC actually be sorc? The staff says it changes 10 sorc levels to PM levels & treats CC as pm 'for the purpose of spellcasting'. Would that mean it is a valid reinc, or would the CC 'for the purpose of the reinc requirements' be treated as sorc? Taking only 19 levels of sorc to force PM CC would be a significant blow to spell selection, as it would mean only 2 lvl 9's... Also, if I have to delete it due to an invalid reinc, I'm concerned I'd loose the staff... so if anyone has any idea it would be a really big help for me in how I approach this The only relevant forum thread I can find on this suggests it may be troublesome... highergroundpoa.proboards.com/thread/23497/sorcerer-reincarnation
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Post by Paradoom on Jan 8, 2021 7:49:10 GMT
While I am not sure about the CC problem here, I suggest to keep it a wiz-pma build. The sorc version just doesn't have enough spell options for the required spells especially at level 9. In the late game you will not like the result. As others and myself have tried it and came to the same conclusion, I can only advice against it.
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Post by chainlink on Jan 8, 2021 9:20:09 GMT
I was going to say ask some people who have tested it and the answer Doomy has provided was exactly what I was expecting, the question I would ask you is how exactly are you expecting to benefit from changing Pm/Wiz to PM/Sorc?
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Post by starcore on Jan 8, 2021 9:28:55 GMT
I have 2 PM's...
I'm currently leveling a 2nd one as 10wiz/30pm with the Illumian XR subrace, and am looking for something to do with the original level 80.
I was originally going to burn a 2nd illumian book to upgrade it, but have been convinced that would be a waste.
On my level 80 PM I'm finding spell slots to be a MASSIVE problem. I'd like to try out the sorc build as an alternative. A lot of the time when I need to rest, its when I've run out of something critical, but often have some other spells unused. Even when I'm familiar with the run and know roughly what to slot, its still a big issue...
With a sorc build, slot usage is WAY more efficient!
The biggest drawback (in my opinion) of sorc vs wiz is the loss of 5 feats...
Spell selection is actually pretty easy... the only tricky part is the level 9's.
Based on what I currently slot on my wiz PM, i'd pick:
9: Energy drain Weird PWK (assuming you get a 3rd choice)
8. Greater spell breach GS Horrid
7. FoD Shadow Shield (random choice)
6. Circle U2D Shades
5. GSC Wrack (random choice)
4. Enervate Bestow SC Vortex
3. Displacement Neg burst Gust (random choice)
2. GV Ghoul touch (random choice)
1. Scare Ray of enfeeble
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Post by starcore on Jan 8, 2021 9:45:41 GMT
Oh one other point... currently shackling as a wiz/pm (or any non spontaneous caster) is a HUGE pain in the ass... like... i never EVER want to do a lower level run on my PM
Shackling my bard is no problem... shackling my wiz/PM, I waste like 10 minutes sorting out my spellbook before and after the run...
The sorc based PM would be a great option for shackled runs.
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Post by boroie on Jan 8, 2021 10:05:11 GMT
Similarly (but different!) I was toying with the idea of using the staff on one of my spare sorcs, just to see what it was like. Didnt do anything with it yet though.
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Post by chainlink on Jan 8, 2021 10:49:18 GMT
I think the simple answer to this is don't do it unless the character is currently excess to your requirements as it may not turn out the way you expect and if there are issues they may not get fixed quickly. It is worth bearing in mind that this class combination did not really work in vanilla NWN.
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Post by starcore on Jan 8, 2021 10:54:33 GMT
Still probably better than the other build idea i had of a theurge/PM
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Post by chainlink on Jan 8, 2021 11:05:40 GMT
Lightweight try a Bard/PM for absolute uselessness.
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Post by starcore on Jan 8, 2021 11:16:09 GMT
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Post by yune on Jan 8, 2021 11:17:57 GMT
You have to be immortal to use the staff. Pretty sure the light won't let you take immortality if it's not a valid reinc at that point.
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Post by starcore on Jan 8, 2021 11:21:57 GMT
Ah, thats what i was looking for... thanks yune! Appreciate the info greatly!!
I suppose it could still work if I went 19 sorc / 21 pm for 3 months...
No PWK means no abyss runs though.... good excuse to get cycles on my other pm I suppose!
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Post by chainlink on Jan 8, 2021 11:42:02 GMT
Hopefully the staff was not part of the level 55 requirement added for 'all' Elysium and Aboleth items or you'll have even more issues, shackling included.
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Post by starcore on Jan 8, 2021 11:47:25 GMT
Oh good point! That would mean it'd be restricted to 19sorc/21pm in any case then. I think it's probably going to end up as a LL/Shackle/Hells toon mostly anyway... so that might be ok. The wiz/PM with the XR subby would be the one for abyss... and beyond? I'm guessing once you 'use' the staff then the CC/Level shenanigan's happen?... it wouldn't need to stay equipped? So I could still use a sardonic staff even if it did get a 55 requirement added (hopefully it didn't though)
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Post by chainlink on Jan 8, 2021 12:35:57 GMT
I like my Illumian PM a lot it has max flex as I took four metamagics (including Quicken) and still managed to fit in multiple standard NWN epics and even ESF Search as I ran out of other useful feats, its a 30/10 build like yours as I didn't want to reduce my offensive power.
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