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Post by Trazik on Apr 30, 2007 15:38:44 GMT
With the changes to paladins combined with the fact that I have a Baseborn Titan subrace itching to be either traded or used, I have been thinking about making a greater smiter, much like the Smite-tacular build described in these forums. I have a build worked up in CBC 2.80 HG and am rather impressed with some of the numbers (emphasis on "some" - see later for concerns). - 42 Str (+16 modifier) - 62 Cha (+26 modifier) - 59 total smiter levels (Pal29-CoT10) - Great Smite 10 - 11x59=649 smite damage (assuming non crit hit) at lvl 60 - divine might for 20 (capped) damage at lvl 41 which lasts for 3x26=78 rounds - divine shield for 39+d6 kickback damage and 26% divine immunity for 3x26=78 rounds Concerns- my experience with smiters is that outside of smiting, they can't hit the broad side of a barbarian. How big an issue is this in HG pre-40? After 40, with Great Smite 10 I would get +10 Str, or +5 to AB. And I guess the potential +14 GMW in addition to Divine Favour makes up for it all. Have I overlooked anything? - sure these builds put out a smack-load of damage, but are they any good in Hells? Anyone with first-hand experience? - What weapon would I use? People keep saying warhammer, but I struggle to see why I would not use Dwarven Waraxe, or Katana or Bastard Sword. Suggestions wanted. - Is Baseborn Titan a good choice? Would I be better off waiting for some BUR subrace that I may have overlooked? Comments, suggestions and advice wanted. Trazik |
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Post by dodrudon on May 1, 2007 6:40:47 GMT
Divine might caps at 20 damage.
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Post by Trazik on May 1, 2007 9:59:22 GMT
 Is there a reason for that? Trazik
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Post by dodrudon on May 1, 2007 18:39:45 GMT
Just how it was coded up. However, note that the divine damage bypasses ALL damage reduction or immunities......
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Post by warder10 on May 4, 2007 7:25:04 GMT
I am currently playing a smiter build and he does excellent damage. My only concern is the amount of damage that he takes.
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Post by Trazik on May 4, 2007 8:22:50 GMT
Well, I am a bit disappointed with the lack of advice for weapons, but I have decided I might go with Light Flail.
Bastard Sword would be ideal with the changes to crit ranges and multipliers, but I can't seem to fit it in to my proposed build (without making a sacrifice to something important):
STR: 16
DEX: 8
CON: 14
WIS: 16
INT: 8
CHA: 18 (30)
0 40 Baseborn Titan: (Quick to Master, Extra Smiting)
1 P 01: Paladin(1): Toughness, Power Attack
2 P 02: Paladin(2): {Smite Evil}
3 P 03: Paladin(3): Divine Might
4 P 04: Paladin(4): CHA+1, (CHA=19)
5 P 05: Paladin(5)
6 P 06: Paladin(6): Blind Fight
7 P 07: Paladin(7)
8 P 08: Paladin(8): CHA+1, (CHA=20)
9 P 09: Paladin(9): Extend Spell
10 P 10: Paladin(10)
11 P 11: Paladin(11)
12 P 12: Paladin(12): CHA+1, Improved Critical: Light Flail, (CHA=21)
13 P 13: Paladin(13)
14 P 14: Paladin(14)
15 P 15: Paladin(15): Weapon Focus: Light Flail
16 P 16: Paladin(16): CHA+1, (CHA=22)
17 P 17: Paladin(17)
18 P 18: Paladin(18): Divine Shield
19 P 19: Paladin(19)
20 CT 20: Champion of Torm(1): CHA+1, (CHA=23)
21: Champion of Torm(2): Great Charisma I, Armor Skin, (CHA=24)
22: Champion of Torm(3)
23: Champion of Torm(4): Epic Weapon Focus: Light Flail
24: Champion of Torm(5): CHA+1, Great Charisma II, (CHA=26)
25: Champion of Torm(6): Epic Prowess
26: Champion of Torm(7)
27: Champion of Torm(8): Great Smite I, Great Smite II
28: Champion of Torm(9): CHA+1, (CHA=27)
29: Champion of Torm(10): Great Smite III
30: Paladin(20): Great Smite IV
31: Paladin(21)
32: Paladin(22): CHA+1, (CHA=28)
33: Paladin(23): Great Smite V, Great Smite VI
34: Paladin(24)
35: Paladin(25)
36: Paladin(26): CHA+1, Great Smite VII, Great Smite VIII, (CHA=29)
37: Monk(1): {Cleave, Evasion, Improved Unarmed Strike, Stunning Fist}
38: Paladin(27)
39: Paladin(28): Great Smite IX
40: Paladin(29): CHA+1, Great Smite X, (CHA=30)
Hitpoints: 518
Skillpoints: 88
Saving Throws (Fortitude/Will/Reflex): 40/34/32
Saving Throw bonuses:
BAB: 30
AB (max, naked): 36 (melee), 30 (ranged)
AC (naked/mundane armor/shield only): 22/30
Spell Casting: Paladin(4)
Alignment Changes: 0
Discipline 43(46), Tumble 40(39)
... so I guess longsword or warhammer may have been the next best choices (under "normal" weapon rules) but Light Flail got a nice boost and it's a bit under-used, so I am hoping it might be easier to find it on trade lists and in the chests.
Advice, suggestions, constructive criticism etc. welcome.
Trazik
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Post by tarrin on May 4, 2007 13:28:41 GMT
I'm currently levelling a similar version, but including 10 RDD levels, which helps a lot with the lack of strength - although only managed to fit in 6 Great Smiting feats. His stats at 41 (when he gets the 6 extra strength): STR 30 DEX 8 CON 16 INT 10 WIS 14 CHA 29 I used the Dragonblooded UR subby, to get RDD in early (plus a lack of Hound Archon). I used a warhammer because of the convenience of already having a few. However, his AB isn't as amazing as I would like it to be. Also, you've typoed  put epic weapon focus:warhammer instead of light flail. |
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Post by wodgard on May 6, 2007 5:45:39 GMT
i gave been running a smiter. just plane human. lvl 45 with his own gmw and max +12 in str he is at about 54ab with a basterd sword i hit oftern 30 to 50 normal round 250 crit (true prismatic blad / self wepon buffs) only yet have smite 8 with him.. its enough to put guardians in the maze at near death or just above. he stands prety well as a tank save boses but that is equipmint trouble not having right resists. at 103ac i still have allot of trouble in the desert .. i am torn up by the archers there. like i were standing nude. saves he is at f69 r51 w61 and he makes most saves but i get caught with the ocasional implode or stoned yet.. umm guess enough rambeling i started with dragonlances build smite tacular.. chaned to work the extras i needed. not getting the free feats from races highergroundpoa.proboards3.com/index.cgi?board=builds&action=display&n=1&thread=1159455998&page=1but in my very limited opinion any smiter with a race that offers ya some wis cha.. free feat or two .. would be a very solid toon just about any where... typo typo typo for good mesure Wodgard |
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Post by Besiege on May 6, 2007 8:32:11 GMT
If the 62 charisma is with +12 items, then your modifier should be at 26. That means you get 20 divine damage for 78 rounds (Divine Might) and 39+1d6 divine kickback + 26% divine immunity (Divine Shield) for 78 rounds.
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Post by drunkenboaster on May 6, 2007 14:45:54 GMT
From my hells experience, paladin builds need to place a few points into constitution. My current hells build, paladin 28 bard 2 RDD 10, has a base con of 24 (26 con with artifact hps 1336). I am glad I did not skimp a single point here because there are so many times I have gotten a heal off just in time with less than 100hp left. The primary role of the tank is to stay alive, damage output is a far second. Your AB can be over 100 and hit for 400+ on every blow, but you will be useless as a tank if you spend half your time dead the other half trying to heal because of low hp.
A paladin can get by on a 40 base strength. Prayer, Aid, Bless, and GMW can get to +19 AB. Taunting is also something to think about, -6 to enemy AC for 6 rounds not only helps you hit, but also the rest of your fellow party members too.
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Post by Trazik on May 10, 2007 5:25:21 GMT
I was out of town for a week; sorry for the lack of activity in this post...  I have made the correction to Epic WF Light Flail, thanks Tarrin Also, thanks for clarifying Divine Might and Divine Shield, Beseige. I will update my original post. On the subject of a Smiter being a tank (and therefore needing to be able to take damage and wanting high CON) ... I am not certain that I have ever considered a Smiter to be a tank. I have always seen them as damage machines that lack staying power. My primary experience with Smiters has been on Arena-PvP servers where smiters take out the casters in 3 or fewer hits and then promptly die because they can't hit anything.  I think Funky and the Devs (sounds like a band name ) have done a great job balancing out the "... and then promptly die" part of the equation. To be honest, I am a bit uncertain how hell-worthy this character might be. I have only seen Tiamt (twice now) with my RDD and have plenty of hell left to experience.  I made this character in order to pass the time between hell runs (in which I hope to find my first BUR subrace). Trazik |
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Post by kaezar on May 30, 2007 1:32:06 GMT
I've made a smiter with a different philosophy from Drunkenboaster and I've found that he's a right about the difficulty of staying alive in hells, at least if you're not equipped with BURs (he just hit 60, didn't go to hell with his BUR equipment yet). But while it's truth that he can be killed pretty fast, the dmg he does while alive compensates for that to an extent. He can take down an Narzugon in 2 rounds flat, even if he does not scores a critical with his smite evil. He did it once on a Amnizu and did 1700 dmg on one blow. On your build, one suggestion maybe. Consider trading your blind fight for exotic weapon and getting bastard sword as your weapon. You'll normally be able to get a Undeath Eternal Foe from your cleric in hell, and that'll make you immune to blindness (no cleric, what do you mean if the party has no cleric? In hell? with no cleric? Are you crazy? Also, I didn't see any reason to push my charisma beyond the minimum 25 + 1 to get an even number. With the paladin charisma bonus I got a modified ability score of 42, enough to push my saves to the low 70's at lvl 60. That seems to be enough to most purposes. I've also done a little looking up on the logs and most non-boss hard monsters seem to have an AC around the high 60's. Of course with curses and bard song and prayer going pretty much non-stop it's a bit hard to be certain, but it's a number to shot at anyway. I'll post here again after I get on a hell run now that he's lvl 60 and has some burs equipped. That may sure change the equation on a hurry. Regards Kaezar |
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Post by cataclysmic on May 30, 2007 1:55:22 GMT
You have never done Hell's without a Cleric? Ya missing out, it is serious fun hehe Perfectly possible too. Back to the topic at hand tho I have a smiter I have been working on tho I have been concetrating on my Bloodfire n Pariah recently, will let you know how it does once it gets to the LL areas, he seems to hold his own in the normal areas pretty well tho. I don't see too many poroblems when he goes to hell but you never know |
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Post by Raj on May 30, 2007 6:51:27 GMT
Consider trading your blind fight never, NEVER give up blind fight on any no-caster build being blind immune doesn't matter at all when monsters have innate concealment, and everything is concealed in hells, up to 70-80%; the recent change to the epic mord is about that afterall. |
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Post by FunkySwerve on May 30, 2007 7:27:38 GMT
never, NEVER give up blind fight on any no-caster build being blind immune doesn't matter at all when monsters have innate concealment, and everything is concealed in hells, up to 70-80%; the recent change to the epic mord is about that afterall. What he said, but it goes well over 80%. BF is critical. Funky |
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put epic weapon focus:warhammer instead of light flail.
I think Funky and the Devs (sounds like a band name 
I made this character in order to pass the time between hell runs (in which I hope to find my first BUR subrace).
