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Post by johannhowitzer on Nov 29, 2016 1:45:08 GMT
Great find, Methes. I probably should have looked that up myself.
So barring crits (if QP can even crit), which on fists should be 5% of the time, Greater Stoneskin by itself should definitely stop any Palm attempts cold. As long as the + is enough, which I will test. I can also push my Fortitude for insurance.
Thanks for the input everyone! TESTING TIME.
EDIT: At level 10, my Fortitude can reach 25. 27 if I ignore Knockdown immunity, which I probably shouldn't.
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Post by fallenwizard on Nov 29, 2016 2:24:50 GMT
problem for you might be if you dont recast soak often enough, normal ppl can use the ur torch with 20/+15 soak (randomized to that with few other properties removed to get lvl required low as possible)
Anyways, i'm not sure if the exp you get there is going to be worth it, but give it a go and see how it turns out.
Also, you could try to find out how low enc they have, as i remember it being very low, iirc lvl 11 armor has 10/+2 soak, if that works that + resist should be enough vs non crit
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Post by johannhowitzer on Nov 29, 2016 2:59:07 GMT
Testing results!
- Lesser Mind Blank blocks Stunning Fist completely, but item mind immunity doesn't.
- Their fists are +2 or less, so at level 10, +3/10 robe from shops acts like a permanent Stoneskin. If I do level 12, robe can be used as a backup for when they wear out Greater Stoneskin. If I somehow find a rare 10/- bludgeoning ring, Greater Stoneskin would cease to be worthwhile.
- They didn't use Quivering Palm on me, but they also never knocked me down when I took off immunity. So I'm thinking +CON boots, and if I have level 12, I can wear better fort gear in general. Should be around +30. Their Stunning Fist was DC41 though, so that's likely only a partial protection against Palm. I can leave Oltum un-dominated for this so he won't glitch out if I die.
- 420 per child with 50% bonus weekend = about 280 normally at level 11. At 12 it will be slightly lower, and competes with Taros only because I can kill many at once, but spawn size will be small. I'll experiment with summons to see if I can provoke bigger spawns. It will drop off very quickly, so one full trip - house and basement - is probably all that'll be worth it. Level 12 seems more worthwhile, since without Greater Stoneskin I can only handle 2-3 kids at a time. This is also a great excuse to loot the basement, which if I recall has quite a few loot spots.
- The shields last long enough for one pack per set, maybe two once I can begin empowering more than just Death Armor. I can afford two sets per rest at level 12, or 3-4 if I ignore Fortitude and wear a ring and amulet for slots.
Setup for the kids at level 10-11:
Master Adventurer's Robe (clothing shop)
Solid Band (Zeke's Hive Mother quest) OR 5/- Bludgeoning belt (location unknown)
Boots of Striding +4 (emporium item shop) - can be left off if level 12+ and Fort not a concern
Fortitude items - ring + amulet + cloak from emporium item shop, Gauntlets of Lesser Enchantment from Rips
Buffs in cast order:
Endurance (fort/HP)
Extended Resistance (fort)
Lesser Mind Blank
Empowered Death Armor
Elemental Shield (Empowered if 12+)
Mestil's Acid Sheath (Empowered if 14+)
Cast Greater Stoneskin at 12+ after collecting kids. They can only interrupt on a crit, possibly not even then, and it provokes AoO on all of them for a little extra damage. I could even wait on Endurance and Resistance until being attacked, if I plan to use them at all. Epic Gloves of Concentration are an option. Potions also provoke AoO, so chugging one a round can give extra damage.
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Post by fallenwizard on Nov 29, 2016 3:41:27 GMT
I remember trying to search blud belt (10/-) some time ago, but only ever found greater swordsman's and greater archer's, it still exists somewhere, my least looted areas would be goblin/hobo > anything from swamp - so my bet is around that since it'd also fit in lvl appropriate areas.
edit: i think 5/- belts for slash/pier are in bandit camp and that cave before crystal beetle, but once again, bludgeon is something i cant recall
edit2: gbb in krenshars, corpse middle of map
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Post by johannhowitzer on Nov 29, 2016 19:44:27 GMT
Whoa.
Okay, so the kids have +1 at most, Cloak of the Ghost requires level 7, and blocks them with +2/10. Add in 10/- bludg belt (great find, thank you very much!), and CLARITY POTIONS which as it turns out also block stunning fist, and I can do the kids at level 7. At that level I'd only have normal Death Armor, but I can mass the first map, then toss on empowered DA and elemental shield for the basement.
I went in nude except for the belt and cloak, and a few slot items for more damage shields. I think this beats everything but the Taros for exp rate at such a low level. I could even grab some ice necklaces and do Goblin Commander while I'm there, so the trip to Krenshar won't double up with a trip later thanks to the Hero Crystal.
I really didn't expect the kids to be this easy. I thought maybe there was a chance I could handle it at 12 or so, with a clever full gear setup, never expected them to be such a free mass kill at level 7 with two guaranteed items.
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Post by condude on Dec 2, 2016 5:54:38 GMT
Is there a reason you care if you get stunned?
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Post by johannhowitzer on Dec 3, 2016 3:27:01 GMT
It's not as much a worry if I have 20 total blocking, but when I had 15, even without getting stunned I was having to heal regularly to avoid dying; with the stun, death would have been certain.
With 20 it's a lot safer, but still not a waste of time to chug a clarity now and then - I have to visit the alchemist anyway, and not being stunned means absolute safety and also no downtime from pull to pull. As well as being able to loot while killing in the basement.
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Post by johannhowitzer on Dec 18, 2016 0:59:55 GMT
Decided against submitting for marathon exhibition this time around.
Going to be a slow burn over the next year finishing and optimizing this speedrun. Thanks for all your help, guys, so much of this has been ideas brought up by people in this thread and ingame.
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Post by sabregirl on Dec 18, 2016 5:27:28 GMT
Glad you're still working on it. Disappointed it wouldn't be this year but, I understand why.
-S
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Post by condude on Dec 24, 2016 5:05:56 GMT
By the way, don't forget that you can read a libram of golden conjuration at level 38 for 1.5 levels, if you're not continually holding levels at that point.
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Post by johannhowitzer on Dec 24, 2016 21:20:53 GMT
Yup condude, I'm actually going to be reading two of them in this speedrun.  |
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Post by johannhowitzer on Jan 1, 2017 16:36:32 GMT
Did some routing work this morning, hopefully much more in the days to come as I'm off work for a full week. I found some interesting stuff and worked out a lot more about the early game route. Since it's a 50% bonus exp weekend, I wasn't able to get an effective experience route test going (seems to always be the case), but at least I figured out what will happen on the level ups. - I finally found the wizard slot ring! One slot each levels 6-9, fixed drop in the farm house basement. So with this grinding plan it's directly in my path. Really nice find, and gives me one more reason to grind on the kids. This is especially amazing as it only requires level 16, and will give me one extra level 9 slot for the start of the Zhentarim grind, very handy. - I will be using the Epic Flag and I will also be crafting it to avoid the targeting problems the large flag can cause. About a 75% chance to craft it first try, so no need to wear craft gear, if I fail I'll just try again, it's like 10k gold. For the sake of menuing speed, the fastest thing for me to craft it into is... a violin! So my character will be doing half the speedrun with a violin under her chin. Awesome. |
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Post by johannhowitzer on Jan 2, 2017 5:25:50 GMT
More stuff today. I did a lot of work off stream; planning things out off stream is a lot more relaxed and I can take thinking breaks or type up notes without feeling like I'm boring people.
- Reanimator is mostly Ice Storms, handy for breaking generators.
- The Prime Bison has a high Fort save, so Phant isn't a good idea, but Max Melf 2-shots him, and Max Combust can 1-shot but has a chance to miss. So Combust has probably 5% chance to take 2 spells, while Melf only one-shots if the Bison fails the save, making Combust the better gamble.
- Ice Kobold archers have +2 or +3 arrows, so I traded out Cloak of the Ghost for Cloak of Premonition before going there. Also using cold resist robe and Displacement for the hut. Only damage I take is the occasional Sneak Attack from a Noble that hasn't succumbed to COB, and the King deals minimal Acid damage that I'm not going to bother covering.
- Rat King and Ice Kobold King both have max possible chance to die to Phantasmal Killer, 90.25%.
- Early on I decided to wear a +2 INT helm since it gives one extra level 2 slot for Invisibility. This proved to be a solid decision for later too, as my INT progression times correctly to yield an extra 6th slot once they show up with just that +2 helm. As I reach another INT mod at the same time as getting level 8 spells, level 18 is the earliest place where more INT will be useful, both for bonus slots and the extra Weird DC. So I'm wearing the +2 helm and no other INT gear from 3 to 18.
- I'm coming up on the Crypt Thing, which is right next to the Fingerbone quest, but due to enemies down there with True Seeing, I really want GS before I do it, otherwise skipping the quest will be far less hassle. GS requires level 16, which is the cap for that tag, so it's looking like I will be holding that tag as long as possible. If I can't stretch exp far enough, I'll just drop that quest.
- I'm trying to find a time where I can justifiably grab a second Wizard's Circle from the farmhouse basement. This speedrun absolutely lives on 9th slots from level 18 onward, so it's probably worthwhile to grab one more if I can; I don't remember needing to wear other rings before reincarnation. Don't need rings for INT, I get +10 just from the Drachen Helm / Belt. Need to find out how long it takes for farmhouse basement loot to respawn; I can return after Formians maybe, when I've done Toad quest and Peppers are available. There isn't another reason to return there until Mother of the Corn and Zerya at 30.
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Post by Werehound Silverfang on Jan 2, 2017 6:05:44 GMT
More stuff today. I did a lot of work off stream; planning things out off stream is a lot more relaxed and I can take thinking breaks or type up notes without feeling like I'm boring people. - Reanimator is mostly Ice Storms, handy for breaking generators. - The Prime Bison has a high Fort save, so Phant isn't a good idea, but Max Melf 2-shots him, and Max Combust can 1-shot but has a chance to miss. So Combust has probably 5% chance to take 2 spells, while Melf only one-shots if the Bison fails the save, making Combust the better gamble. - Ice Kobold archers have +2 or +3 arrows, so I traded out Cloak of the Ghost for Cloak of Premonition before going there. Also using cold resist robe and Displacement for the hut. Only damage I take is the occasional Sneak Attack from a Noble that hasn't succumbed to COB, and the King deals minimal Acid damage that I'm not going to bother covering. - Rat King and Ice Kobold King both have max possible chance to die to Phantasmal Killer, 90.25%. - Early on I decided to wear a +2 INT helm since it gives one extra level 2 slot for Invisibility. This proved to be a solid decision for later too, as my INT progression times correctly to yield an extra 6th slot once they show up with just that +2 helm. As I reach another INT mod at the same time as getting level 8 spells, level 18 is the earliest place where more INT will be useful, both for bonus slots and the extra Weird DC. So I'm wearing the +2 helm and no other INT gear from 3 to 18. - I'm coming up on the Crypt Thing, which is right next to the Fingerbone quest, but due to enemies down there with True Seeing, I really want GS before I do it, otherwise skipping the quest will be far less hassle. GS requires level 16, which is the cap for that tag, so it's looking like I will be holding that tag as long as possible. If I can't stretch exp far enough, I'll just drop that quest. - I'm trying to find a time where I can justifiably grab a second Wizard's Circle from the farmhouse basement. This speedrun absolutely lives on 9th slots from level 18 onward, so it's probably worthwhile to grab one more if I can; I don't remember needing to wear other rings before reincarnation. Don't need rings for INT, I get +10 just from the Drachen Helm / Belt. Need to find out how long it takes for farmhouse basement loot to respawn; I can return after Formians maybe, when I've done Toad quest and Peppers are available. There isn't another reason to return there until Mother of the Corn and Zerya at 30. You wouldn't consider a server hop, rest, regear and heading back to the farm? Would that eat too much into your time vs waiting? |
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Post by johannhowitzer on Jan 2, 2017 7:32:49 GMT
One of my rules for this speedrun is no server hopping. Hopefully it won't ever be necessary; of course if I can't do the full run under 12 hours, that'll be a problem, but I have high hopes it won't take that long.
The idea for the loot respawn is to come back later when it's respawned, I just need to know the respawn time so I don't come back early. I already know the farm, POW, and Zhent respawn times for the sake of grinding, and that'll factor into my routing eventually - returning as often as the respawn will allow, while using the downtime to get other things done. Gate also plays into this, as it will often allow me to warp back to a grinding spot instantly.
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