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Post by doomsdaybringer on Mar 28, 2006 5:32:19 GMT
can u give pally/ranger/bard class epic spell? maybe at least bard?
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Post by FunkySwerve on Mar 28, 2006 5:36:28 GMT
Can I? Sure. Will I? Not without a really good reason. Like I said in the Thoughts and Ideas/Speak Your MInd thread, I won't be revisting ranger for awhile, if at all, and the same goes for most of the finished clases. ESPECIALLY paladins, they are plenty powerful. You're more likely to see Legendary Spells on mages and priests. Funky
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Post by Lord FlashHeart on Mar 28, 2006 11:05:45 GMT
I still think something could be done with fighter based around the only fighter exclusive feat - weapon specialisation/epic weapon spec. Maybe up the phys damage from a paltry 2 for weap spec and 4 for epic weap spec to 10 for WS and 30 for EWS or something (altho that wouldnt necessarily do much to the highest lev mobs who seem to be immune to phys.)
Maybe at least 25/30 levs of fighter needed to gain this benefit as you can get EWS with just 5 levs of fighter.
Either that or change the damage type from phys to something else, similar to what was done with the paladin smite.
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Post by Lord FlashHeart on Mar 28, 2006 11:18:34 GMT
Also i thought it was a good idea making the DB shield stupidly heavy. Just checking my LL51 str based mino carrying capacity and its 22700 lbs! Maybe improved AC items or improved DI% items with massive weight would work - a set of armour and a shield with ac 20 would up str based ac to about 122 - still lower than dexers who can make the 130s but maybe enough to help in the post immo areas. If each item weighed about 7000lbs then wearing both would need a carrying capacity of 14000 which leaves enough for carrying stuff (altho my mino is legendary and gets more str than other subraces.) Maybe its worth fiddling with carrying capacity checking how much a nothing but str based build can carry at certain levels and then make some heavy items that only these str based builds can use without being encumbered.
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Post by FunkySwerve on Mar 28, 2006 14:13:28 GMT
Maybe its worth fiddling with carrying capacity checking how much a nothing but str based build can carry at certain levels and then make some heavy items that only these str based builds can use without being encumbered. I already did that. That's WHY that shield weighs 2k lbs - only a STR build can use that unencumbered. Funky
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Post by Delfestra Ruinvorn on Mar 28, 2006 15:56:41 GMT
Can I? Sure. Will I? Not without a really good reason. Like I said in the Thoughts and Ideas/Speak Your MInd thread, I won't be revisting ranger for awhile, if at all, and the same goes for most of the finished clases. ESPECIALLY paladins, they are plenty powerful. You're more likely to see Legendary Spells on mages and priests. Funky Mmmmm more wizard spells *drool* ...I bet they'll require LL-Focus, right? Not just more for the epic focus prereqs? And there was some thought of benefits for pure classes a few posts back - would this be one of them? Aka must have 40 levels of X to use?
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Post by ZeroGravitySE on Mar 30, 2006 4:50:02 GMT
Playing druid on the server u tend to learn that quilfire becomes a main atk, and only 80dmg/pop is kinda low I think it should be increased to atleast double the dmg, to make the druid class a extremly effective dmg class to single target. Everything else is pretty much perfect about the druid some spells work better then others, and earthquake is the biggest waste ever. lol
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Post by FunkySwerve on Mar 30, 2006 5:40:16 GMT
Were actually changing a number of druid spells in the comin update, including earthquake, but quillfire will not be one of them. Funky
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Post by holla on Mar 30, 2006 18:44:23 GMT
Having made a pure casting druid myself I found that the only effective offensive spells currently are quillfire and FoD, but these are only single target spells and so often was spamming ice and fire storms in most areas. It's nice to hear that druid spells are being revisited and I have a few ideas for spells to put forward.
Crumble - double current damage. Is very specific to enemy type and therefore imo should be far more effective than all other spells vs them. Drown - change to AoE. This would give druids an equivalent spell to the wail and implosion spells, as its only lvl 6 I would suggest that the spell only becomes AoE at casterlevel 35, this(I think) would limit the effect to casting druids only and not to dragon or shifter builds. Creeping Doom - change from physical damage to negative, I only say negative as it sounds like it should be to me. Elemental Swarm - AoE elemental damages. Imho this spell is useless and as a lvl 9 shouldn't be. I suggest using the same ghx as creeping doom(possibly coloured) and making the damages elemental types acid/cold/elec/fire and maybe sonic, tho I'm not sure if this qualifies as elemantal really, damage based on casterlevel i.e 17-23 1d4, 24-29 2d4, 30-35 3d4, 36-40 4d4 of each type, duration 1rd/2casterlvls. Also as stated above with Earthquake and I think Bombardment could use a boost.
Not sure if you feel this would unbalance the class or if any others have any suggestions as this is not a class I've discussed in game with other players much.
All the best Holla.
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Post by FunkySwerve on Mar 30, 2006 19:33:25 GMT
Having a look at elemental swarm and crumble. Changes I already made in the update to drop later today:
Earthquake - Save changed to fortitude instead of reflex. At casterlevel 25 and up, the damage increases to d8 per level and the damage type switches from bludgeoning to positive.
Bombardment - At casterlevel 25 and up, the damage increases to d10 per level and the damage type switches from bludgeoning to divine.
Storm of Vengeance - At casterlevel 30 and up, the storm does 3d6 points of fire per round, in addition to the acid and electric.
Creeping Doom – At casterlevel 30 and up, the spell begins at 2d6 points of damage, and increaseds by 2s, to 4d6, 6d6, 8d6 and so on.
Cross-class spell cghanges will effect clerics too.
I may switch CD to neg but I think that might actually make it less powerful, especially PvP. I think getting the damage right is the trick - at 1d6 increments its useless, and at 10d6 increments (where it was briefly about 6 months ago) its the Uber Maiming Spell of Wrack, Ruin, Devastation, and Splatter. Gonna give 2d6 a go. Problem with AoEs is lag, so while I don't like them to be useless in all situations, I DO prefer that they are less useful than other spells in most situations. As for drown, I think its more powerful than people realize - NOTHING is immune to it, while almost everything is immune to harm. Can someone please verify whether drown is a touch attack? There's no evidence of a touch attack req in the spell but one of the dms seemed to think it was. Funky
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Post by holla on Mar 30, 2006 20:08:02 GMT
I've just tested drown, its short range but no ab check is made therefore I dont think its touch, also there is no sr check showing on log. seems a straight reflex save or 90% damage. Undead and constructs are immune to drown.
Hope this helps, Holla.
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Post by holla on Mar 30, 2006 20:12:43 GMT
Correction on last post, save is fortitude not reflex.
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Post by ZeroGravitySE on Mar 30, 2006 22:06:14 GMT
Dragon Angel's Druid Handbook ----------------------------------------- Alright just to throw you some idea of how much knowledge I have behind RPG gaming I could say I started out with ultimia online, and ever since then there hasn't been one MMORPG that I haven't either beta tested for a minimum of 2-3 months or played for more then half a year where around then I usually hit max level and quit the game. I am a power gamer I know all about tactics in games and group dynamics. I LOVE TACTICS. Some of those games names are, Ultimia Online, Asheron's Call I & II, Everquest I & II, Dark Age of Camelot, Planetside, Final Fantasy XI Online, World War II Online, Dark Age of Camelot, City of Heros, Ragnorak Online, Shadowbane, Anarchy-Online, The Sims Online, Neocron, and many more...
The Druid @ Higher Ground are defently underpowered (big time). I still play with pride because I love druids. I played Druid in Everquest & DAOC, was one of the first to reach the max level of 50 before any others on my server. So as you can tell I'm a hardcore player too.
I've only been playing in the server for about two months now, popping in and out and I have two immo characters that are pretty weak compared to other's combo's. My one is a all STR fighter which without Dev. Crit. I pretty much quit fighter. Most people say, well taking on fighter as your main class is silly? Why? Fighters should be the only class that can hold its own when it comes to getting beat down hard.
A druid in my eyes, is a major support class. Druids are the balance of nature. That means they have a good offense and defense. The druids pet is perfect with mass heal at your side you can stand back have you pet beat up something while healing yourself and your pet.
So the first section is the server changes that are active right now. I've added my opnion and views on the spells, how effective they are, and other things alike. I love the druid class so much I don't mind working with anyone to make it a great class to play. I like a challenge but when clerics can wail, and kill everything one hit. Druid are kinda left in the shadows laughed at.
MY Format ------------------ (DA)(COMMENTS) DA= Dragon Angel
[[[[[[[[[[SERVER CHANGES & MY VIEWS]]]]]]]]]]]] This book lists the custom changes made to druid spells in this module. The spells are listed by level. Unless otherwise noted, changes effect monsters as well as PCs.
Epic Spells: ------------------ Greater Ruin: damage doubled to 70d6 (DA)(This is fine, don't see the point in changing it)
Hellball: damage doubled to 20d6 of each type (DA)(This is fine, don't see the point in changing it)
9th Level Spells: ------------------------- Earthquake: uncapped damage to 40d6 at 40 (DA)(Chaning the dmg type would be helpful, but even if the dmg is saved the major problem with the spell I had is it couldn't hit nothing, and it destroy's loot! So its a double negative right there, who cares if the dmg is changed the spell is resisted everywhere and it destroy's loot!)
Summon Creature 9: this now summons new, more powerful elementals, at the following caster levels: 35 - Radiance 30 - Vacuum 25 - Ooze 20 - Magma (DA)(The Radiance Ele, isn't death immune, so as soon as you summon it, POW! GET THAT STUFF OUT OF HERE! ITs dead.)
8th Level Spells: ------------------------- Bombardment: removed cap to 1d8 per caster lvl up to 40 (DA)(Bombardment is probly the only cool spell druids have, but the problem I have is the dmg type because physical gets resisted like its nothing. I was doing like 3 dmg to some creatures when @ 40 its suppose to do something above 40dmg? 40d8? So WTH! Change the dmg would defently help. This spell also destroys loot, has a huge range.)
Finger of Death: changed successful save damage to d6(3) + casterlvl*3 (DA)(I don't have epic focus in necromancy so I don't know if this spell is really effective or not. But it only does 143 single shot if it hits without kill. So the spell is pretty much useless unless you have a high DC)
Premonition: casters clad in armor heavier than clothing or wearing a shield will cast the regular version of the spell; this spell will end if armor heavier than clothing or a shield is equipped after casting; damage absorbtion limit increase to 50*caster level; at casterlevel 20 gives soak 30/+6 at casterlevel 24 gives soak 30/+7 at casterlevel 28 gives soak 30/+8 at casterlevel 32 gives soak 30/+9 at casterlevel 36 gives soak 30/+10 at casterlevel 40 gives soak 30/+11 (DA)(I use medium armor and shield, so I don't know what to say other then it helps some for me.)
Summon Creature 8: this now summons new, more powerful elementals, at the following caster levels: 35 - Lightning 30 - Steam 25 - Ice 20 - Mineral (DA)(WASTE)
Sunbeam: uncapped to 15d6 vs non-undead (DA)(Cleric has it, so there not gonna tweak this much)
Sunburst: now does 15d6 against non-undead rather than 6d6; damage cap vs undead raised to 30d6 (DA)(Probly right now one of my most fav. spells. Why do you ask? Because it does magical dmg 15d6 to anything and undead get the arse end of it. Which there is alot of undead on this server.)
7th Level Spells: ------------------------- Aura of Vitality: scaled up to +12 stats, AC bonus added (dodge type)(PC only) lvl20 +4 stats +2AC dodge lvl25 +6 stats +3AC dodge lvl30 +8 stats +4AC dodge lvl35 +10 stats +5AC dodge lvl40 +12 stats +6AC dodge (DA)(This spell would rock if it LASTED LONGER! And once u get past 40+ most people already have stuff that gives them max in STATS. The Dodge bonus is nice too. This spell is only really good under 40 and I just throw it on now to help a little more for those with crappy gear.)
Creeping Doom: damage cap raised to: 1100 at 25th level 1200 at 30th 1300 at 35th 1400 at 40th (DA)(This would be the best druids spell but it gets resisted alot, and it starts out really slow. It wouldn't be hanging around so much if it did more dmg. Its dmg type and the way it deals dmg need to be changed for this spell to be worth anything after 40)
Firestorm: uncapped damage on both types, for 20d6 fire and divine at lvl 40 (DA)(Firestorm is a great spell but its cleric too I think, so empower firestorm rocks, but it still doesn't make the druid unique on its own.)
Summon Creature 7: this now summons new, more powerful elementals, at the following caster levels: 35 - Ash 30 - Dust 25 - Smoke 20 - Salt (DA)(WASTE)
6th Level Spells: ------------------------- Crumble: uncapped+ to 40d6 (DA)(This is a great spell! Only probly is its single target! If it was atleast more then one target, or had some type of AE range, I'd throw it in my spell book more.)
Energy Buffer: at level 20 the damage absorbtion limit increases from 60 to 25pts of damage per level, capped at 1000 pts at llvl 40 (DA)(very nice.)
Greater Stoneskin: casters clad in armor heavier than clothing or wearing a shield will cast the regular version of the spell; this spell will end if armor heavier than clothing or a shield is equipped after casting; absorbs up to 20/level before ending, capped at 800dmg at lvl 40 (PCs only) at 20 gives soak 20/+6 at 24 gives soak 20/+7 at 28 gives soak 20/+8 at 32 gives soak 20/+9 at 36 gives soak 20/+10 at 40 gives soak 20/+11 (DA)(very nice.)
Healing Circle: at casterlevel 20 and up healing was increased to 1d8 + (Casterlevel x (Casterlevel/10)), to a maximum of 1d8 + 160 points at casterlevel 40 (DA)(a joke.)
Regenerate: Scaled up from 6 to +12: 20 - 7 24 - 8 28 - 9 32 - 10 36 - 11 40 - 12 (DA)(What would make this spell very useful is doubling that regeneration. Now that would be some real regen! Druid style! I forgot if this spell is shared though, so... w/e if it is.)
5th Level Spells: ------------------------- Awaken: bonus scale changed, now able to effect summons and henchmen as well as animal companions, bonuses to str, con, and wis = +1 every 4 caster levels capped at +10 (DA)(Please look into this to help the druid level 40 pet a little, by atleast giving DEX to? FOR SOME DEFENSE?! That would be great if my pet had higher AC I'd have it out more.)
Ice Storm: at lvl 20, the phys damage increases from 3d6 to (d6/3caster levels) (DA)(w/e)
Inferno: at casterlevel 21 and up, damage increases to 6d6 per round (DA)(This would be fun if the dmg was doubled, that is so low! 6d6 IS A JOKE!)
Slay Living: damage increased 10 3d6 + (2 x caster lvl) (DA)(never really use it)
Wall of Fire: This spell has been modified to create a wall of stone, lasting one round for every two levels of the caster. (DA)(The stone is funny to play around with and block view from archers. I've also used it to block pathways so that there can be only way to me... thru my pet!)
4th Level Spells: ------------------------- Mass Camouflage: added concealment %1 per caster level, lasting 1 turn per level (DA)(I really think the time should be doubled on this, or something. If I remember right druids don't get hide as a skill so this spell could mean alot! I need to keep out of view of those tuff targets, I am a caster!)
Flamestrike: cap increased to 30d6 at 30 (DA)(w/e)
Freedom of Movement: added movement speed bonus - lvls 20 and below - 20% at level 21 and above add 3% per level to max 80% increase at lvl40. (DA)(In almost all games I've played with a druid class there has always been a increase speed spell. Freedom of movement is nice, but the truth is, its still slow really. I'd love to see it double the movement. So when a druid needs to flee, they can!)
Stoneskin: (PCs only) at level 20, the amount absorbable increases from 100 to (15/casterlevel), to a limit of 600 at level 40; gives the following damage reductions. at 20 gives soak 10/+6 at 24 gives soak 10/+7 at 28 gives soak 10/+8 at 32 gives soak 10/+9 at 36 gives soak 10/+10 at 40 gives soak 10/+11 (DA)(w/e)
3rd Level Spells: ------------------------- Call Lightning: uncapped to 40d6 at lvl 40 (DA)(I love this spell but its resisted so much later after 40, it becomes useless.)
Greater Magic Fang: bonus now scales up to +10 at lvl 30 (DA)(My class pet is a joke, so the one I summon from the server, is so much better. Why is this only for my crappy pet?)
Healing Sting: damage increased to 1d6 + (caster lvl x2) (DA)(w/e)
Infestation of Maggots: at casterlevel 21 and up this spell does 2d4 Con damage per round (DA)(w/e, creeping doom is better)
Poison: will scale up venom type by caster level (pending testing of poison effects) (DA)(lol)
Protection from Elements: progression changed to absorb 10 points of damage per caster level (DA)(very nice.)
Quillfire: scaled damage up to 1d8 + (caster lvl x 2) (DA)(This spell is so important and it does the crappiest single dmg. Its like the main atk of the druid for anything when it comes down. Most the dachy equip. doesn't slot in the area's where quilfire is. So I have around 25-30 shots of quilfire max with dachy stuff. With that said think about that? I'm casting that spell that many times, and it only pops for around 80-90. I think if it did around 140-160 that the spell would be perfect. It would give the extra edge that spell needs. But the requirement for such a thing should be pure 40 levels of druids. So people don't sub-class for the specific spell)
2nd Level Spells: ------------------------- Barkskin: changed progression of ac bonus to 3 + (casterlevel/6), capping out at +9 ac at casterlevel 36 (DA)(This is helpful till you hit 40 then the real gear starts to kick in.)
Bull's Strength: at casterlevel 20 and up this spell adds 2d4 +2 to strength (DA)(Very helpful.)
One With the Land: at casterlevel 21 and up this spell transports the caster to a safe resting spot, but only if they are in a natural outdoor area (DA)(It seems like all the places most people go to are either in the water, or indoors, this spell sucks unless low levels, but even then, why waste the spell slot?)
****extra**** UNDERWATER DRUIDS - We suck hard in the water. We can't hit nothing under there other then with quilfire and with the arrows being shot right at my head, its hard to always land hits so close.
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Post by gaxx on Mar 30, 2006 23:49:34 GMT
I agree in this regard. I think druids and shifters are underpowered. I have both and hardly ever play them. I wouldn't make such drastic changes as that, but most definitely need beefed up. A druids summons should be the best in my humble opinion...
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Post by FunkySwerve on Mar 31, 2006 0:11:46 GMT
Nice to have some input from a druid fan! That said, what wasnt helpful was reprinting the entire list of spell changes only to put 'very nice' or 'w/e' or 'waste' next to most of them. We're looking only for suggested changes, not editorials. I DID alter Greater Magic Fang based on your remarks, however - the error in the stadard spell description caused me to miss it in thje first run of spell changes. I think if you keep looking you'll find uses for some of the spells you are currently dismissing. Please feel free to make more suggested changes as you did with a few of the above spells, and please feel free to comment on spells we haven't already altered. Best, Funky
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